I am exploring certain arabian books, that seem interesting i wanted to try techniques, some of them are offensive toward demons,
Do the demons and angels, know the intention, in the sense that if i do an offensive technique its just out of curiosity ? I can delete the text parts that are offensive, but there are many times words that hold no meaning that are to be recited, so i cannot really be sure that i made the technique appropriate
That being said, generally how do you ´try’ techniques safely? Is everything offensive to never be tried. Are there dos and donts?
In my experience, based on working with the Djinn and the Book of Smokeless Fire (which is based on the Deadly Names) - if you attempt to use a technique that is strong-arming them, without the "offensive part of ding the actual bullying - it just doesn’t work. They don’t respect it or you and nothing happens.
The “meaningless” parts do have meaning, you’re just not doing the ritual if you skip them, you’re doing something else.
If that’s what you want, I’d say just use a totally different technique, like the modern qrimoiric system with petitions or evocation.
There’s risks in this kind of magick. If you want “safety” don’t do baneful magick or or with baneful entities. Stay home.
If you want to mitigate the risk, get your warrior vibe on, and be ok with getting hurt, getting back up, fixing yourself and getting stronger for it. A warrior prepares for battle and practices with his gear, including defense - get your protections in order BEFORE you start. You accept the risk and deal with it.
I was finding in those books there are 3 different types of ´spirits’ one can work with, ´higher realms entities’ , earthly entities ( i am doing word for word translation ), and the inferior entities or underground entities or lower realm entities i do not know how to translate that. The inferior ones are to be the most effective and most responsive with the higher risk, while the higher realm entities are said to be low to no risk. When i read more, i found out many of those are actually the demons, Satan etc.. Not all, but at least some, since books like the sun of gnosis by al buni, talk from islamic perspective, thus satan cannot be ´higher realm entity’. I speculate what they mean by higher realm are the angels but i am still not sure, they also claim those are not as fast and responsive as lower realm entities. Thats why i questioned if many of those are the actual demons why not use technique without the attack parts… given the fact demons already are responsive to me without those
The first thing about these cosmologies, is they are just models of reality - they are not actually reality - they are not “true”, they are someone’s way of trying to explain how they saw things.
So, there’s no such thing as “actual demons”, because the term demon is too vague and applies to many kinds of entities, it’s just used as an insult for most of them, not even a species
This is why I use the term “entity” or “being” - also vague, but neutral, without the emotional baggage, religious prejudices, and implications and assumptions that are illogical and just get in the way.
The word you’re looking for is probably “cthonic”, or possibly “infernal”. Both meaning underworld, just from different traditions.
I think I partly agree with that model, but I don’t believe there’s a difference between earth and underworld. I actually don’t believe in an underworld at all, except as a mental categorization meaning, “lesser entities”. I think of these as astral wildlife.
That’s me, I realize most traditions put humans in he middle. I follow a taoist model. I think the physical IS the lowest, densest level of reality there is, and everything else is “higher”, or more subtle / rarefied levels of energy being.
So… recalling "as above, so below / as below so above / as within so without / as without so within" - look at this place, we have parasites, predators, bacteria and fungi, death and decay, with beings that are not really very sentient - they are stupid and run on instinct like little machines. It’s not malice that a mosquito bites you, it’s just doing what it does. It’s not malice or evil that you kill it so it doesn’t bite you, that ;s how this world works.
So it is “above” - there are lesser entities that are too stupid to be verbal, that feed on us because our energy is available and that’s all they do. They are the parasites of the astral, not underworld.
There are also clever predators and parasites, that are verbal but unevolved, so the only way they know how to survive is by dragging others down instead of building with them.
BOTH these abilities and behaviors are from what I call earth-bound entities - they’re not strong or good enough to become cosmic beings
Then you have humans, Djinn and energy/ higher beings. Some humans and Djinn are earthbound, because they remains in a unenlightened state feeding in others and make themselves into parasites and predators. These reincarnate.
Some humans and Djinn evolve beyond that and become higher beings and part of galactic civilization - your ascendeds, angelics, some ETs. They may or may not choose to keep a body on Earth These are not here to feed on others, they don’t need to.
Completely wrong. This is like saying “a hammer is faster but higher risk while a screwdriver is slower but no risk” - risk of WHAT, exactly? Like attracts like, you have the same risk of backfire if your magick is baneful is all cases - this is up to you and yourintention, and your energy.
Both kinds of entities are effective, it’s up to you the operator to gain the skill to understand what you are doing, who you are talking to and select the right tool for the right job.
Because you already offended them with the technique itself, and then took out the part that made them do the work, rendering the technique empty and useless. Use a different technique.
again, use the tool as it’s been design and intended, don’t pick up a screwdriver and try to use it as a hammer, it won’t work.
“Only a poor tradesman blames his tools for doing a bad job.”
Thank you! I saw in your profile you have more than 25years experience, that’s impressive! I wonder what is your opinion on siddhis, when i researched those, i found two major opinions, some who advanced in order to be able to perform those, like moving objects, reading thoughts, etc.. and some instead achieve those through entities, like reading thoughts and remote viewing replaced instead by the help of an entity that does the work and just tells the needed information to the magician.
Obviously, both need advancement, but the path through entities look more attainable, i did not yet meet magicians that did something like knowing information about me that they have no way of knowing unless through magic, those kind of experiences i did not have them with magicians, many had, so i wonder how common and how hard is it to get to those ´powers’ through entities. Like knowing something private about a person with help of an entity instead of remote viewing and such
So, these are two different things, that I outlined above. Developing a skill is not a siddhi.
Working with an entity needs the skill in the first place, the entity can’t do it for you, so whether you telepathically get the info from an entity as middle man, or directly doesn’t matter that much.
However, nobody meditates to gain siddhis, that’s not the point of that meditation, and you can meditate for 20 years and not get the siddhi you wanted. The abilities are seen more as distractions and the warning is, that if you are meditating to get “power” - you’ll never get it. Because your intention is all wrong to get the ascension anyway.
This is why we work on our skills as a basic part of practice. Again, here’s the link to the astral sense development thread - I don’t give this out for no reason
What is your opinion on being secretive and not telling others experiences? Some advocate for it saying entities dislike talking too much about what they did for you, but i am unsure about all this. Sometimes i want to ask about experiences but i get afraid some entity will dislike it and stop giving me the experience..
For me: Don’t even bother. at best, it’s pointless, at worst, it will have a negative affect on your on your magick. People’s ill will is a kind of cursing, so don’t give people ammo to curse you with.
The Christians said it best:
Don’t waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Do not cast your pearls before swine. They will trample the pearls and then attack you. – Matthew 7:6
That’s between you and the entity in question isn’t it? I would say that is part of your relationship with it, and not a blanket rule. I’d also say to not make assumptions, and never just take other people’s hearsay as your truth - when in doubt, always ask and find out for yourself.
I don’t see why. You’re most at risk of other humans putting out energy against your working.
I did notice in my life when i am doing certain techniques and they working wonder, when i start telling people or over preaching, i face setback, or it does not work like it used to be, i always need 1-2 weeks to go back to the inner feeling and state i had in relation to the working, and the confidence i cultivated, i thought its all in my mind, thank you for explaining!
In relation to entities, i found out many times its actually opposite, if i tell someone, this entity approached me, and he laughs at me or try to ridicule me or whatever, the entity gives me better experience after that event. Its like if they do not like people mocking this
I researched more, i found out what they mean by underworld, is they merge abrahamic religions with this, they say Demons refused to be like the angels, and there is a war between them, that cause the demons to hide in the underworld,
In same time, they say demons are more effective than angels in workings, because the angels are bound by certain rules they should not violate, while the demons are more free, for example, if you ask an angel to attack a person, he may do it but not in a very bad way, they hold back, while demons, are all in.
In addition, what they do is they do baneful magic with the demons, even the famous ones, like Satan, so there is a famous prayer they use, that is claimed to torture demons, so when they do magic that involves demons, they add the prayer that tortures them, or when the work is taking too long, they use the prayer to accelerate.
This is said to backlash in very bad way, given they claim the demons will seek revenge, this is why they advocate serious protection, but still it always comes with High risk, the more potent the work or the demons involved, the higher risk for the magician,
They do the same with angels, they torture them to get the work done,
I am disappointed to find this, since i view demons are beautiful beings i will never do similar, i do not think that i will ever do it with an angel too, even if i never experienced with angels.
Also, i believe one really destroys his relation with demons or angels if he attempts what i said.
Im more into agreements and being in good terms with demons. Rather than forcing them.
Not really - the lore is similar for angels and the Djinn. The story is that god created then first (angel or djinn, either), and then god created man. And then god said that man was awesome and the ag=ngels/djinn should respect man as the foremost best form, or woship him or some such silliness.
This is supposed to have made them quite upset, as they were the beloved ones, and there was nothing wrong with them. The djinn, or alternatvely is Jewish lore, 1/3 of the angels, said nope - the “rebelled” - and they wouldn’t worship humans, and that was what the war in heaven was about.
The war was lost by the “rebels” and they were “cast down” to Earth, and became “demons”.
I think, if you actually think it though, the whole story is propaganda and utter horseshit. Nobody rebelled, because nobody was asked to put humans first or worship them - notice there’s no worshiping going on anyway? And if you ask me, I don’t WANT to be put first or worshiped - that’s stupid.
I think some angels or djinn - some of them are just the same thing - stayed on Earth to help humans and we call those the Watchers, and that wasn’t the first time they’ve done that and it won’t be the last.
Ergo, there’s no such thing as “demons”. It’s a psyop.
