So EA specifically but also innumerous posts on the forums talk about how powerful the demons are and what they can help you achieve etc. Virtually no limits on that apparently.
Yet when a beginner asks for why they cant make contact its always on the beginner to put in more work to be able to hear them.
This makes literally zero sense to me and its bugging me so much that it prompted my lazy ass to actually create a thread about it.
How do you guys make sense of this? Incredibly powerful entity that can literally change the course of the world, but can only say “hello” to you after youve put in X amount of practice hours.
If I desire to talk to someone who expresses themself in a different way than I do (language barrier, etc) it is up to me to put in the work to learn how to communicate with them. I see it in a similar way when it comes to spirits. If I want to hold conversations with spirit XY (who might use a different language or their own understanding of communication) it is up to me to educate myself at least in a basic way to achieve some level of mutual comprehension.
Guess it’s kinda like saying, you can walk into a store and buy a skateboard, but if you run into Tony Hawk on your way out and ask him how to be a pro skater he’s gonna say a whole lot of jargon that makes no sense until you have practiced for a couple months.
Or to keep the same analogy, it’s like playing Tony Hawk’s Pro Skater and thinking that makes you an expert in skateboarding as a sport.
There isn’t a real analogy for it. Long story short, even the most powerful entity isn’t gonna be able to give you the merest glimmer of an impression unless you’ve actively worked toward being on a level where you can receive it or understand it. Sure you might get results from a petition, but unless you’ve put in the work and developed the skills to hear/see/feel entities, you can hardly expect Hollywood level magick.
Demons, gods, etc, don’t exist within the material plane. It is on you to pull them into your individual universe. They could be screaming at you all day, but if you’re not tuned in, you’re basically deaf to them. It’s like a radio signal that you’re not aware of until you have the proper receiver.
Why did you have to learn to walk, and talk? You were born with the potential, but still had to learn the skill,. Communication with extra-dimensional entities is really no different.
Firstly I am grateful for all your replies. All of your analogies make sense but only if we assume that the gods cant communicate to me on my level. And thats the point where Im stuck.
They can do all these things but I have to be tuned in/learn to speak their language/whatever you wanna call it.
Why can´t they tune in to the channels Im capable of using?
I´m immeasurably frustrated by this. I moved away from the Christian way I was brought up in because it required me to believe in stuff that made no logical sense to me.
I was happy to read about the Luciferian path which allowed to question things, but now I feel like Im at the exact same point again where I have to believe in stuff in order to move forward. Even if it makes no sense to me.
You’re the one wanting contact, so it would make sense that you would have to reach out first. Remember, this is our plane of existence, not theirs, and we have generally closed it off to spiritual phenomena.
it takes effort on their part to come down to the physical world, so the least we can do is meet them half way and put in some effort of our own.
The thing with magick is, though, once you’re tuned in, you will basically be lit up like a Christmas tree on the higher planes and will draw the attention of various things, some benevolent, some not so much. They need a way in, and we provide that for them. The universe is full of spirits, but it’s like waving your hands in front of a blind man. If you can’t see them, then for all intents and purposes, they don’t exist for you, just as radio waves didn’t exist for us until someone built a machine capable of detecting them.
I guess thats an aspect I dont have in my worldview, meaning the idea that its hard for them to interact with our world like we do.
Is it a more correct view to see them as subtle influences on our world? By subtle I don´t mean weak but just…well subtle
So for example if they wanted to move a cup theyd have a really hard time grabbing it, like a human would, and moving it. However they could subtly influence a human to move the cup for them.
Am I somewhat on the right track here?
This would at least explain to me why they wont just come up to me and be like “Hey Chris, here I am.”
It’s possible they can exert a subtle influence, but on the whole, they are relatively impotent here without a human opening the way for them (there are also certain places where energies meet that can act as portals, where the “veil” between planes is just naturally thin). That’s why you don’t generally see large scale demonic infestations, or angelic armies marching across the sky except in the movies.
As EA Koetting always says whenever he’s asked as to why demons work with “lowly humans,” it’s because in doing so they get the chance to exert their power in the material world in a way they otherwise cannot, and it helps them to grow in power and stature in their own realms.
Well thank you @DarkestKnight and everyone else aswell for responding and helping me change my view a bit.
It was seriously frustrating me and I feel like I now have enough input to come up with another outlook on things.
So thank you guys, I really do appreciate it!
You don’t necessarily need to communicate in words to receive results from a petition or even an evocation.
Forgive my over-use of analogies but if you travelled to a foreign country where you don’t speak the local language, you could get by with a mishmash of pre-learned phrases, charades, Google translate, or a phrase dictionary. As long as you can communicate effectively (to a greater or lesser degree) and get your point across – if you’re a beginner than that should be a goal in and of itself.
Most people don’t go into their first attempted full evocation and have a conversation with an entity as though they’re a human being sitting across the dinner table from you.
I understand the allure of wanting to converse with entities but ultimately if your goal is real world results, full evocation is not necessary.
I do use petitions and such and I can even be optimistic and say that my life in general has improved a noticable amount since I set out on this path.
Its just…well, I guess old views which I needed to update.
Are you advicing to take small steps?
If so then Im on board as I also think its the most sensible approach. Im beginning to repeat myself now so Ill probably stop after this post but the logical inconsistencies were what made me so frustrated. Its not necessarily the fact that I need to have a foolproof conversation with an entity right this second, even though that would be nice and I wouldnt complain if it would happen, but rather my inability to comprehend how they can help you achieve all sorts of things but cant come through into this world and say hello.
But yea, I will use the input I got and try to form a new worldview which makes more sense to me now.
I can say this because I’ve been there. I’ve been where you are. I wasn’t always able to hear spirits or see them. But I put in the work. And now I’m at a stage where I can see Demons psychically (with eyes closed), I can communicate with them (it’s spotty but I’m moving forward fo sho) I evoke a few times a week and practice. Pick a demon to help you.
Look up @Mike_Bee thread about Prince Orobas where he talks about picking a spirit and having them help you practice. I’m doing that and it’s working like a charm (pun intended).
You will get results long long before you can hear them and communicate. In my experience, If you’re serious about learning and developing your skills, the spirits will come to you!! They see you.
So at the risk of being redundant I’ll say this, don’t doubt yourself, it’s possible, I’ve done it, many others have as well and I’m not someone special (except to my mum). So you can do it too.
Ohh and the most important thing is Meditate - rinse - repeat. It was a game changer for me.
Thank you for your encouraging words.
Ill keep at it for sure. Normally I regress after a doubting period but now I feel like keeping going, in part because of the great answers I received.
Its always good to see that someone had to struggle with the exact same problem and made it through to the other side.
