Who is Belial, Who is Lucifer and Who is Satan - Research, Masks, Gnosis and Mindfucks

General Discussion
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I invite you to share here what are your gnosis and/or conclusions about the masks and origins of these beings!

Here’s some analysis so far:

Belial (Bliol/Belhor/Baalial/Beliar/Beliall/Beliel/Beliya’al)

I’m not sure if Matanbuchus/Mechembuchus/Meterbuchus is an original name, because how could this be an original name if it means “worthless gift”. Sounds like another title, like Belial (without a master/wicked one/worthless one).

Asenath Mason says in her invocations that Belial was created to be an angel and that he was created just after Lucifer, which after encountering him I started to doubt (possibly because of the huge increase in power of that being) but still would like to read what you guys have learned about who Belial is after all!

It’s said that Belial has a mask called Beelzebub (Baal-zebub) and that Belial is also the same as Baal. Some think that Satan is a mask of Belial and on the other topic I’ve just replied to, authors (Baron/Baroness Araignee) say that Belial is the same as Samael :no_mouth: They were claiming that Belial told them that he was the oldest demon and the same being as Samael.

Old texts (Bible/Apocryphal) say that Satan and Belial are the same being. He could also be the same as Masterma/Mastema the accuser angel, that later became Satan. Possibly he could also be the God Bel mentioned in the same texts.

We also know that lord Belial is the first gatekeeper of Hell, and that no one enters Hell without first passing by his gate.

Lucifer (Heylel הֵילֵל Shining One, Morning Star, Amaymon)

Michael W. Ford says that Satan is actually Lucifer (Heylel הֵילֵל Shining One, Morning Star/Amaymon), which is also the same as Ahriman, Samael and Set.

At least for Lucifer being Samael, he says that it should be the same because Samael means “the Poison of God”, which also sounds more like a title than a name.

I think it was Enoch Petrucelly that stated in his last book that Lucifer is the emperor of Hell. Apparently EA Koetting claims it’s a being called San’tula (Santola) and VK Jehannum claims that’s a being called Sanatas.

Could Santula, Sanatas and Lucifer be the same being in different masks?

I wondered for long if Satan was just a thoughtform or is it a combination of Lucifer + Belial (metagod)?

Some claim that Satan is an independent being and others claim that it is the same as Ahriman but as mentioned above, at least to author Michael W Ford, Ahriman = Lucifer. I haven’t read Kurtis Joseph’s conclusions about this specific name Ahriman though BUT EA Koetting claims that Belial taught him that Lucifer is not the light bearer, Lucifer is darkness (and isn’t darkness = Ahriman?). “The shining one” shines darkness.

Could the combination of these beings of Daath create a Sphere called Satan? (there’s a chart but I didn’t upload for not getting one more censored post for Balg’s commercial reasons).

PS: Since your personal Hell could be self-imposed by consciousness (guilt and good vs. evil interpreting), couldn’t these beings be masks of the Archons? Not saying this to disrespect these beings that I am so into but just coming to probably the highest mindfuck conclusion ever possible, that would probably be too much for our limited human brains to process :open_mouth:
In the book Questing After Visions EA Koetting talks about an angel telling him that demons serve divine purpose (but it was never said in the book which purpose it is).

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My UPG is that Satan is actually a title, not an entity. Granted, I haven’t tried invoking the guy, but I base this more on the fact that multiple demons share the moniker of Satan.

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I understand that, any satanist/luciferian or whatever LHP is Satan (we can call ourselves satan if just by meaning enemy or adversary), but if you take a sigil and evoke Satan, Satan will come. Who is that being? This is what I was talking about. Also BALG will be releasing a book about a being called Satan as the 9th Gatekeeper @Prophet.

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Interesting. I’ll keep an eye out for that one.

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An interesting note from my own research of Belial: one of his other names, Beliar, is a Greek name meaning “Baal or Lord of the Forest”, suggesting the Greeks may have associated him with their God Pan. I find it interesting how some of the higher ranking demons are viewed to be associated with the wilderness, where many prophets and holy men in multiple Faith’s have to go in order to achieve Gnosis or Enlightenment. Yet these entities are somehow evil…very funny how man can twist things.

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There has been so many called beings lucifer, in spiritual world, and physical reality, that lucifer is title, nowadays, if you like …

Belial i dont know that well,i have not have time for it, but dont make these stupid things, like satan-belial, treat everyone as singular.

satan is conciousness, there have also been so many satans, sammael, shaitan, etc, so i would call satan a level of conciousness.

BALG satan is again different version of being that reached godhead, yam nahar is actually kurt cobain, or conciousness of soul of kurt cobain, i dont respect him as satan.

i dont work with greys…

I haven’t read Kurtis Joseph’s conclusions about this specific name Ahriman though BUT EA Koetting claims that Belial taught him that Lucifer is not the light bearer, Lucifer is darkness (and isn’t darkness = Ahriman?). “The shining one” shines darkness.

It is all how you define darkness… darkness doesnt have anything to do with evil, its just knowledge hidden from plain sight…

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Samael is a mask of Lucifer not Belial. If you evoke Samael you feel that too. I have never heard that Samael is Belial…
Amaymon is a different being too. I never did understand how they got Lucifer Amaymon, maybe the sale was good.

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My question is do the identities serve a purpose of formula? As formula and as beings I rather seem em all as separate…

My critique on the who Lucifer , and who Satan is is

  1. one needs sources that have academic clout of being written from doctorates or proffessors in areas such as mythology or archaeology.No disrespect for the magickians who channel, evoke and then write of the entities, but feel way way way more compelled to trust one who studied the aspects of the cultures which derived the root name, titles, and traced the evolution of such…because information is business.

  2. What i term personality demonalatry is kinda a cult in and of itself, whereas instead of media, one is amused by the relationships, personalities and goings of entities rather than pop stars. This can be used as a means of boosting sales. Seems different cults and lodges have different associations, attributes affixed to the multitudes of entities of a said name.

  3. Humans who acquire information can also skew it to what they want it to be unconsciously. Cognitive biases are human which is also why i’d prefer the approach of studying artifacts, dating them, and acquiring knowledge of a dead civilizations mythology, over word of mouth of what someone was told by an entity

What is known is Lucifer is a title, not a name -Lightbringer . In Greek Phosphorous and Hesperus were brothers. One the morningstar and the other the eveningstar, (hence some will claim the light of Lucifer is dark?) , They later became one object- Venus
Why is he associated with hell? I dunno…
Satan is a title- adversary , stemming from Set according to some sources

Belial - worthless one but also one with no master(or so i have seen it depicted as such)

They are titles.

Names is another issue. How do we turn titles into names???I dunno the answer.

Question, is it possible (since one can use gods and goddesses and spirits as formula) the associations of for example Lucifer with Satan is deliberately being used by the magickian writing such as a formulae for their own transformation?

I guess, next step would be getting ppl to believe such, and perhaps this empowers that combination of eggregores based off of the entity that any magickian would be working with…Perhaps if I said Lucifer is Goddess Venus , someone believing it fuels an eggregore of that combination of the entities they are related to, and that causes a different effect on my body, reality than saying Lucifer is Osiris (which no one has calimed yet, but i use it to illustrate a point) …

Who they who hold a title are in name, i don’t know. Or perhaps its a question of who they are to u if we are using them as formulae to achieve an occult end…As the entities, I don’t see how we can know. How can one know the entity and not an eggregore is doing the work after a ritual (because who cares so long as the result comes forth) ???I am wary of channelers or meditations that yeild such and such answer, because different clusters of practitioners get different answers all the time, if they are in fact doing that and not tapping the identities of the beings for personal eggregores… Its like asking what a hypercube in the fifth dimension tastes like…

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chocolate!

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I feel as though many occultist like to over-complicate things for themselves and in turn think it just has to be over-complicated for everyone else. Maybe because it was simple they’d lose the overly mystical vibe it gives them :man_shrugging:

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its because simple is too mystical of a vibe, and the spiritual stuff is unpalatable.

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I find spiritual stuff to be pretty interesting, often times blending pretty well into mundane, but many feel the spiritual has to be over-exaggerated instead of simple, or overly philosophical instead of simple.

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Im coming from a materialist standpoint, and more of a paradigm requiring things like physics…more of a fringe approach. It’s very hard to digest the spiritual stuff because of how the data is presented, and I naturally have a skepticism where i by nature have to question how such knowledge was acquired, classified and so fourth…

Spirituality doesn’t follow scientific method, so its a pill i rather avoid.

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skepticism is a healthy necessity

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I suspect what we are seeing are personal keys to illumination. Lucifer as the “lightbringer” is being placed in combination with entities one would wish to explore, or levels of consciousness.

It’s worth experimentation, and if im wrong i will pay the price for it. My interests lie in using the formula to create a key to both Apep and Cthulhu…so Lucifer = Apep & Cthulhu, as a means of reaching in to explore and illuminate 2 entities with seemingly nohing to do with Lucifer, until i start finding and creating similarities…

The risk of being wrong is learning what was really done in creating the associations between different daemons and gods. I suspect they are personal keys and fit into the magickian’s personal gnosis…

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Actually, before becoming a Spiritual Satanist at age 17, I was originally a convert to Judaism at age 11. In Judaism, Satan or Lucifer is the Archangel of Mars and Tuesday Samael the Lightbringer who to the Jews is The Satan. Satan, Lucifer, Samael, Ahriman, Ptah-Ra, Malkira/Melek-Ra, Enki, Melek Ta’us, Apollo, Baphomet, etc are all names and titles of Diabolus Samael who, according to the Jews, is responsible for the Aryan or Indo-European race, which isn’t hard to believe, because in Grimorium Verum, Lucifer’s domains are in Europe and Asia.
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“This Serpent SATAN is not the Enemy of Man, but it is he who was the first to make Gods of our Race, knowing Good and Evil. He base, “Know Thyself,” and taught Initiation. His planet is Saturn and zodiac sign of Capricornus, the Leaping Goat of Freedom and Liberty. His emblem is Baphomet, the symbol of arcane perfection.”

  • Aleister Crowley said something like that
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You need an introduction.

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I know an old name of Belial that I am not allowed to tell anyone. Generally he just prefers being called Belial. He is definitely not Lucifer and I think not Samael but he is related to Samael in some ways I think because they both used to function as “Satan”. Belial is close to Lucifer and listens to Lucifer most of the time.

He can appear like an angel sometimes, not just in appearance but also energy, although he does not act like one. He does act as a god though, particularly I’ve seen him present himself as Hindu gods.

That being said, to my understanding all of them are individuals yet connected, I don’t mean just Lucifer Samael and Belial but all the deities you could think of. They’ve emanated from something far greater and multidimensional, in response to the world. That’s all I could say.

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Why aren’t you allowed to? and why mention it if you’re not allowed to :thinking:

also to present yourself as something isn’t the same as being something, that’s how parasites attach to people but presenting themselves as something other than what they actually are.

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Just mentioned it to make a point that he might have older name. Idk why im not allowed to tell that particular one.

Yes that is exactly why i said he presented himself as Hindu gods. I was surprised to see that. To me he was still Belial and I was wondering what he was doing. Felt like it was just for fun. Or maybe he was filling in for someone else.

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