What is "the void" actually?

I have seen more than a few mages claim to work with the currents, energies, beings, etc of what they call “the void”. It’s not just black magicians, it has become quite popular in modern witchcraft as well. Here’s the problem, I don’t see how and why “void energy” can be real.

A void has no “energy” because there is nothing inside it. That’s the whole point of a void; it’s definition is “a completely empty space”, meaning that space is devoid of energy, matter, etc.

In order to create an empty space, a void, you need “edges” to define the dimensions. The edge of a void is when there is energy, matter, etc. It doesn’t matter what that energy is, but wherever there is energy there is no void. I say again, that’s the whole point of a void; it’s utter lack of energy and the fact that it’s nothing but x,y,and z axis waiting to be filled up with something else. Void is just space. It’s just an empty structure, it has no energy because as soon as there’s energy, matter, entities, etc inside the void, it’s not a void anymore by definition.

If someone else has a personal explanation for this, or what a void is, comment below. I might have a misunderstanding of this altogether but I’m open minded.



void is what comes before/beyond x, y, and z

there you go


Take the contradiction and hold it within yourself it is a great power. Do not attempt to reconcile it, you will only make it less.


Above Keither is the Ain Soph Ur, the void is the Ain, the all, limitless. It is the nothingness, the woumb of the Goddess from which everything came. it is the basis and foundation. Words can only point at it. It is the fall of Babylon and your true face. :eye:


Void is a representation of the feminine where creation stems from , so it actually probably has a ton of potential for energy and creation


A lot here confuse the void with darkness.

The void is infinite space between the realms and outside them, but in terms of energy it’s also the primordial soup of creation such beings that embody this void is Khaos, Tiamat, Nun, Apzu, the three the zokasanshin etc, neither masculine nor feminine as well as both.

I don’t really like how it often times gets confused with darkness, mainly because they feel nothing alike, yet darkness is birthed from it, so is all the other elemental energies.


When you see a painting, what you see in it: the flowers, the people, the colors.
The void is both none of that but the essential part of them.
The void is the canvas.


Welcome @Zehir It is a rule of this forum for all new members to properly introduce themselves, so PLEASE CLICK THE IMAGE BELOW and tell us about yourself and any experience you may have in magick, such as what you practice, how long you have practiced, areas of interest, etc:


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Depends, who teach. Draconic, or qliptogh tradicion. Current. Ir magia what ever u want to call. Even if its void, amd transcend, its have to be ruled, by who,? Wat.? Maybe astral travel. Be great to find out

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in it’s simplest form,
is entropy.

In it’s more complex form,
it’s the Abyss.

In it’s Abyssal form,
it’s intelligent black liquid matter,
that lives both outside our universe and within it.

But more easily described;:

What, keeps the Electron apart from the Neutron?

What, do you think, is stablizing form to be solid?

After all,
it’s not mass,
mass is simply an illusion gained from exelleration.

So what desnifies a mere idea,
into being completely physical?

It’s Entropy. It’s void.


  • actually accurate Answer.

Ain Soph Ur,
Or Erebus,
are names given to the primordeal void.

However, i wanted to avoid crossing it over with deities,
to prevent misunderstanding.

Well, As mentioned,
it’s ruled by a few beings.

Asmodeus is one.

Lucifuge Rofocale another.

Amun-Amamaymon is another.

But you could just as easy call on C’thulu or Thoth. Or Seth.
Even Anubis And Bastet work.

At least in my expierience.

try to work through Saturn at the beginning,
it’s much easier that way.




@Yberion I forgot I posted this ha! But thank you for that explanation. I’ve learned a bit more since the original post; about the void referring to primordial “nothingness” that things come from. But if the void is reference to a black primordial soup of potential energy," formlessness" is probably more appropriate.

But this does sound similar to how I use the Navajo concept of what they call “The Dreaming”. For background, I use a 3+1 worlds system. The first three are Overworlds, Midworlds, and Underworlds. I’m sure you’re familiar with those terms so I won’t bother explaining them in detail, but together they form a “turtle shell”. The middle world is sort of… malleable and flexible, so the Over and Under worlds (polarity) provide structure. The Dreaming though, is the ocean the turtle swims in. It’s the oldest realm of them all, and theres some distinct similar characteristics.

For starters, The Dreaming is comprised entirely of “Chaos” or “Discord”. Also, in the pure most legendary state of The Dreaming (which almost no one can access because of super convoluted phenomena and my mentor can do it but I can’t) there is “nothingness”. Its just a pure white, blank, vast expanse, and walking into the horizon yields nothing other than nothingness.

The abyss/void seem similar in that way. Anchient, the oldest, chaos/discord, etc. And also, just like the Over and Under worlds provide structure for the Midworlds, the “turtle” itself wouldn’t exist without the ocean, The Dreaming.

The biggest difference though is that The Dreaming is white and flat, but that’s the “dayside”. It does have a “nightside” too though. I’m fairly convinced they’re just different interpretations of the same basic concept.



and if you look into a creation myth, i think it was the egyptian or the norse,
it’s also called that way.

trying to find the right words for everyone who listens to you,
is a pain in the ass.

for example [quote=“Tekidor, post:11, topic:120706”]

makes absolutely no sense to me at all.

Then again, yes, i am very firmly familiar with the World Turtles.

in that sense, the Void, is the Ocean the Turtle swims in,
but it’s not the Ocean itself,
but the Emptyness between the water molecules,
which is equally present between the molecues of the Turtle’s body.

@Yberion I say “discord” because of my understanding of the metaphysics behind it. Imagine that you could hold this “discord” as a white ball between your hands. The discord has two main properties. Disruption and “Serenity”.

Discord is inherently disruptive. When it interacts with any agent, the agent becomes disturbed because of it. However, discord cannot be disruptive with discord itself, and because discord is the elemental zenith of “disruption” it cannot be disrupted any further by any agent at all. So it forms a second property I call “serenity”.

Now, if you were to take this ball of Discord in your hands and try to split it like a cell between it’s two properties, you would form “destruction and structure” from the split “disruption” and “serenety”.

From there you can build things with it in The Dreaming. As you place the structure down when you plant the destruction/ “cosmic seed”, in the Chaos, the polar struggle that happens as a result, things will manifest and you can direct it towards your will. In effect it’s like creating a circle of yin with a dot of yang at the center.

But I use the word Discord just because my mentor uses it, and I dont explain The Dreaming to people very often cuz the wording is difficult for me to get across to someone without the background. But hey, that’s why I didn’t get the void symbolism for so long.


great explenation,
thank you Brother

Now, the void i mean by entropy,
is the disruptive force,
and the building forth,
techniqually is the growth energy.

Building, and de-constructing.

Yes, i agree,
we simply use different wording & Termonology.

To my knowledge,
the Energy we use in spellcraft,
basically stems from these:

After all,
it’s the only method to create new planets i am aware off.

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It’s chaos. It’s both destruction and creation. It’s the source of all life and death.


I want to agree with this but it seems to simple of an answer to me. That may be because of how my Discordian Beliefs have shaped my thinking (special thanks to @Tekidor for the interesting insights on discord as an element almost). I agree with chaos being both destruction and creation… but as I have said before any words that can be applied to it only makes it lesser.

What I dont agree with is chaos being analogous with void.

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~ replace Obox-OB with Shiva, or Satan and you have full access in this world,
to those energies and concepts.

however, it’s not advisable to call on Obox-Ob or an Oberyth directly,
unless you’re used to the Void Energy already.

But it’s the best way for me to give you some form of comprehension.

work through Ahriman / Asmodeus first.


I actually saw the void a few years ago during a “chaos-sphere” meditation I found on YouTube. Some might describe it as “hell”. I saw oscillating/pulsating blackness and various creatures that looked “half created”, some were in the process of being created and others were in the process of being destroyed. I remember seeing a lot of strange things. One of the things I remember vividly to this day was seeing an eyeball that wasn’t attached to any sort of body or head, with the optic nerves just hanging off of it. Oddly, I wasn’t that frightened, I was more or less curious.


Check my response to Yberion.

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Yes, the plane you describe is a side layor of the abyss, a hidden layor.

It’s like teleporting into a solid brick wall.

When traveling the qliqqhoth you find similar places.

I ‘m no expert on the qliqqhoth however, it’ s not my language and I haven’t worked through their content full.

I’m to busy with other things. :wink:



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