I found this page on www.satanisgod.org that I found very interesting. Spirit Abuse
I just want to know what you guys think about the idea of Spirit Abuse.
Are magicians abusing spirits when they call them in the Goetic manner and are there consequences for such actions in the afterlife?
If a entity wanted to show themselves to you they would, the idea that we have the power to force them to by using the name of a God or a personās idea of āsourceā if a being comes to you itās because they chose to, and if you do abuse them you wouldnāt have to wait until death for them to get revenge if they sought it out.
Of course depending on the entity even after you die they may want a crack at you.
but respectful evocation/summoning doesnāt warrant the title abuse.
I tend to treat spirits as ājust some dude,ā because we are, also, spirits ourselves.
This is the way core shamanism teaches, you donāt either fear and grovel, nor do you go into a contact all full of commands and threats. So I kind of agree, somewhat, though I donāt share JoSās full-on religious-like reverence of Satan.
That said, as with ājust some dudesā in life, sometimes you have to exert righeous authority, and also, which gets less coverage, sometimes you have to cede authority as well if itās a specific situation (eg you donāt slap your boss at 10am on a Monday and say āIām fucking off for the week bitch, do my job for meā because it suits you to keep that job, so you cede authority in a specific context).
Iām going to share something I posted elsewhere:
Seeking oneās HGA and courting it, or seeking oneās own Higher Self or Guardian Angel for guidance etc., is a form of making up to your own inner manager, so your own bullshit canāt Karen you later in life.
Basically that Karen > rude/lazy clerk > Manager meme is the entirety of eastern, western, magickal, and religious thought all unified in one simple image, with the only tension felt by those who arenāt doing right by their duty in any situation, and their own higher self.
LHP/black magick is the quest to become the manager, again itās a form of unifying all three, for personal ascent and power. 
#BecomeALivingKaren
And Iām not joking here, either. 
This ^
I donāt find the need to either give my power away in worship nor try to take otherās power. Teamwork is a thing too.
Never thought Iād see #becomealivingkaren, very inspirational. Although yes, I am in the same line of thought.
The haircut allows cosmic rays to interact with the zeāal chakra. 
(Okay that bit might be a bit less for real. 
)
Here is a good analogy, people like to think that weāre āso differentā from animals. But the truth is besides our frontal lobes and whatever else that biologically gave us the advantage that we have currently with our line of evolution vs animals. We are still one and the same. We are animals too.
Itās similar with people and spirits (again this is along my line of thinking and possibly a bad comparison). We are all just spirits, but where we are different (and our advantage) is that we are incarnated vs disincarnate spirits. We have the same origin but in different situations/evolution.
But I donāt think people are all powerful compared to spirits. I think we are mostly equal. Some faring better or worse then others, probably same with spirits. Different skills/talents, backgrounds, situations. I do think that our brains are evolved to be very centered-thinking or self-centered ā we need it for our survival. However it has its downsides.
I might have engaged a little in Spirit Abuse. Though, this was mostly out of ignorance and frustration and I am not sure if it was before or after I read about it because I would have done it on two occasions, one with and one without the 9 ft. magical circle, and one not using the conjurations from the Goetia and another time using the conjurations.
But now that I have read about it I feel sorry and I even apologized out loudly.
The last time I tried to evoke King Belial, I cut my palm and smeared my blood over his sigils after meditating on them, chanting his enn, and thinking of my intent of having him there. I wanted to feel his presence again before I made my plea but needless to say I donāt think he came.
Out of frustration again, I was contemplating using the circle, the triangle and the stars found in the Goetia and this time the conjurations from the Goetia to get him to come.
At the same time, I donāt want to abuse any spirit so I might not do it. Things are very desperate however, so I am not entirely sure.
You know when a kid points a toy gun at you and you do an overly dramatic pretend death? Or they hand you a toy phone so you answer it and have a conversation?
You are the kid. And they are the grown up going āooooh noooo! You got me! Ugh. ah. Oh! I might not make it! Okay okay I will do what you ask!ā
Thank you.
Iām so new to this, I had to lookup HGA.
On your point about exerting righteous authority, I went into this originally with entirely that mindset that the spirits basically have to do whatever I ask of them and I am that boss who gives orders.
Now with more understanding I see that while it is possible to go that route it is not necessary. Itās better to establish mutual respect. I also donāt want to get on the bad side of any spirit.
JOSās ideas about Spirit Abuse are his own opinions but I wonder how the spirits actually feel about it. Have you ever personally used the Solomon ritual circle with the conjurations from the Goetia with results and how did the spirit(s) take to it?
No, as I said I use a ājust some dudesā approach, so gearing up with the paraphanalia of a different worldview, in which 72 specific beings are linked to ātheā 72 names of God, and also to different human frailties, which I must evoke, without becoming seduced, and overcome, isnāt my own thing in life.
Though arguably it does fit with the hardcore Hermetic > Law of Attraction concept that what is outside of you is linked to inner states, so Iām not dismissing its value, just saying I have never used it, and am therefore not qualified to comment. 
I think @Anziel_Merkabaās posts might be more useful to you on this? 
Iām not sure āspirit abuseā is even a real thing.
I mean, cāmon, in black magick we talk of things like trapping souls, killing other humans over petty shit, playing with dead things, forcing our will onto others, feeding on the energy of other living beings, mindrape, driving enemies to madness, and a host of other, far less savoury things.
Yet supposed black magicians are all boo hoo hoo over forcing a spirit to stand in a damn triangle? Give me a break. 
Black magicians regularly bind spirits to places and objects, throw curses, and inflict pain and misery upon others for no other reason than they can, but somehow yelling godnames at a spirit, or threatening to torture them with fire until they submit is āabuse?ā Plaguing another human with hallucinations and nightmares until they return their ālove,ā is okay, but yelling at a demon is definitely a no no.
The demons have repeatedly told those who ask that they donāt really care how they are called, only that they are called. You can use the Solomon method, or you can crawl on hands and knees demonolatry style, it doesnāt matter to them.
In the Solomon system, the abjurations and threats are only if the spirit is uncooperative and recalcitrant. Itās not done out of malice or sadism, and itās not abuse. If some of the stories we get on this forum are even half true, the spirits abuse people far more than the other way around.
A friend of mine use to evoke goetia and treat them like they were just tools (ofc he thought they were shadow people) but he would evoke them and bind them and mistreat them if they didnāt do as he said and he got fucked over for it.
So Iām sure spirit abuse is a thing if humans can abuse each other spirits can abuse each other, itās more than likely spirits can be abused by humans and vice versa can be abused too.
I definitely think abusive relations between man and spirits exist. I think though itās a two way street. I donāt feel like Iām abusing a spirit to evoke it into my triangle before me. I donāt feel like Iām abusing it to ask it to help me with something that itās known to have helped others with. Maybe the spirit doesnāt feel like heās abusing the magician when he ātestsā the magician by turning his world upside down. Iāve had bad relations with a powerful spirit before and itās not something I wish to experience again. I really dont like the concept that a spirit will put me through trials that ābenefitā me. I have enough bullshit I have to deal with without a spirit adding to it. I just wonāt accept that kind of relationship with a spirit. I need the spirit to do what Iām asking it to do in a way that the collateral damage is minimized (atleast for me). The answer in my mind is friendship, mutual respect and a business like relationship with the entity.
I really donāt like the idea of forcing a spirit or anything else to serve me. I rather like the concept of Iām the boss in our relationship but letās see what we can work out together for eachother that satisfies both of us.
Thatās my take on it.
Yes. They seem informative. Iāll check them out. Thanks.
A friend of mine use to evoke goetia and treat them like they were just tools (ofc he thought they were shadow people) but he would evoke them and bind them and mistreat them if they didnāt do as he said and he got fucked over for it.
You donāt have to get into it but how did he get fucked over?
It originally started with his relationships going to shit, friends, family, his gf, it started with falling outs from there, then he started becoming toxic personality wise and kept making notes of nightmares, then last I spoke to him he was really ill. He ended up quitting this stuff but thatās when I last heard from him. Itās what he gets, people all too often forget these beings can fuck you over and do have preferences to how they are called and treated.
Yeah @anon48079295 I can say my experience goes with what youāre saying. I experienced something similar but not to that degree of severity myself. This was many many years ago but it left a lasting impression on me about how to conduct myself in dealing with the spirits. I agree with you very much.
but somehow yelling godnames at a spirit, or threatening to torture them with fire until they submit is āabuse?ā
It sounds like it at least. Ha.
Iām just going to play it safe and be respectful in spite of the fact that I am frustrated at not feeling / seeing the spirits and not having any results thus far.
I agree that mutual respect is a necessity when dealing with spirits, but I just find it funny, and very hypocritical, for black magicians, who do things like trapping souls, cursing people to be tortured beyond death, supposedly killing angels and gods, and sending spirits to torture a person until they somehow choose to love them again, to call Solomonās magick abusive.
Hello, kettle, meet pot.
