Is truth really an exceptional value?

[Abhinandan_Mahant]

I read it in ramayana before. Here is link:

Sloka & Translation | Valmiki Ramayanam

It is probably religious so that people don’t progress very much. Isn’t magic also about about believing in something which is not true but may turn true later?

[Mulberry]

Truth is important because the opposite is delusion and insanity - The English word “insane” literally means, unhealthy or unsound.

@Abhinandan_Mahant

Isn’t magic also about about believing in something which is not true but may turn true later?

No, not at all. If you think it’s not true your magick will fail because it being true is why it works.

[Abhinandan_Mahant]

I remembered that there is mirror shield which shows entities what they want to see, but inside shield, there is difference. isn’t that lying to others?

Also an example to make it more clear, there may have been misunderstanding. I don’t have a girlfriend currently, which is the truth, but I am doing some magic which involves believing that I have a girlfriend currently, just an example I am not currently doing it.

Also is telling others lies for positive things good or not? I remember that when I was a child I felt highly for truth, as time passed I felt that for positive things lie can be told, then later on I decided to not tell lie even for positive things.

Also I may spend extra time when telling a thing truthfully like to confirm it, it does not seem that efficient.

[Theoricus]

Some unwise soul once asked Jesus “what is truth?”.

[Abhinandan_Mahant]

Here I read about spirits lying

About Lying

I say Belial is with you brother, he is the best liar I’ve seen lol. Sometimes you have to know when it needs to be done and when it’s just stupid and petty. Awesome job. @J.A.Ragnarson. hell ya

Do demons ever lie to humans?

This just popped up in my mind. Do demons or entities ever lie to humans? I am sure they will avoid answering to questions like when will I die? But there must have been occasions when they would have felt that you should not know the truth, hence they lie to you. Or they always deliver the truth? Any such experiences?

A spirit who detests lying

Asmodeus, Archdemon of Lust, ambition, Wrath and personal power

Most of my career as a sorcerer of the LHP has been spent under the patronage of Asmodeus. Asmodeus is a bastardization of the Persian name Aeshma Daeva. Or Demon of wrath. However he always insisted that the original translation was wrong, and in fact his name translates as Demon of PASSION. Which of course encompasses both lust and wrath, as well as ambition which is the “lust for power”. Asmodeus and Aeshma ARE in fact the same entity, albeit different aspects thereof. Aeshma is far more atavistic (primal) and intense then Asmodeus. Asmodeus more often then not appeared to me as a very well dressed gentleman in black with a crimson tail coat with gold trim, and long black hair. He is very eloquent and direct, and loves to talk about whatever you wish to talk about. He will always teach you that which you wish to learn, all completely without judgement. His only demand, at least to me, has been that I approach and treat him as an equal… and a king. Yes that has a double meaning in that we too are sovereign. Treat him as a King and he will treat you as one. He once made a claim that I cannot verify, that Soloman, in point of fact “worshiped” him, not Yaweh. I cannot in any way prove or disprove this as there is little to no evidence that Soloman ever existed. He is a consummate sorcerer, as lord of the 7 spheres. Some take this to mean that he is the master of all 7 chakras. Even though that is true, what is meant by this (according to him) is that he is a master of all for…

It is written in the link I posted before that truth is the highest virtue, does not seem to be true, it may have been translation issue so I wrote it as exceptional instead of highest.

[Mulberry]

@Abhinandan_Mahant

I remembered that there is mirror shield which shows entities what they want to see, but inside shield, there is difference. isn’t that lying to others?

Yes. Now ask why. Are animals using camouflage lying? yes. Why do they do that?
Because they’d be attacked?
If they didn’t they would no longer exist as a species.

I believe every being has a universal right to self defense.

Lying without provocation, or as an attack, is not the same thing as lying to avoid being attacked.

@Abhinandan_Mahant

an example to make it more clear, there may have been misunderstanding. I don’t have a girlfriend currently, which is the truth, but I am doing some magic which involves believing that I have a girlfriend currently

This is not lying, this is called the Law of Assumption. You are changing the energy around you to attract the situation you desire. You literally said you know what the truth is, and you’re changing that.

@Abhinandan_Mahant

is telling others lies for positive things good or not?

No it’s not “good”… but that is the wrong question. The question is, would the alternative be worse?
It’s not virtuous to hurt people just so you can feel good about being brutally honest. That is selfish and that’s not good either.

We don’t always get good options, in which case I think it’s better to take the least destructive path. Try to make the world a better place not worse.

@Abhinandan_Mahant

Also I may spend extra time when telling a thing truthfully like to confirm it, it does not seem that efficient.

That doesn’t sound like a problem. take the time and don’t be lazy. Laziness is not good either.

@Abhinandan_Mahant

It is written in the link I posted before that truth is the highest virtue, does not seem to be true, it may have been translation issue so I wrote it as exceptional instead of highest.

Truth is the highest virtue, but there is another saying … “needs must, when the devil drives”.

We don’t live in a lovely, easy world where we never have to face difficult situations. We often must choose between multiple bad choices and do so without enough information.

Welcome to being human.

The least we can do, is our best to make like easier and better for everyone, to not be lying, manipulative and mean… many people don’t get that far, for as many reasons as there are people. You don’t have to be one of them.

All you can do is be the best you can be with the information you have at the time, no one can ask for more.

[Mr.Black]

Yes.

Would you call a Dog a Duck? Your Magick properly manifesting is a sign that it is properly synched with the physical world.. properly aligned. That is truth

[Abhinandan_Mahant]

Why would the spirits lie like this?

Do demons ever lie to humans?

Most of the times demons have lied to me, it has been because I was not prepared to know the truth (they tell it to me later) or because the “lie” was the “truth” at that time, Sometimes they also joke in a macrocosmically sarcastic way, which could be mistaken as lying if you don’t have that sense of humour. I would also like to add that my sucubbi and my incubus have a tendency to conspire in my favor behind my back, which involves lies that are much like if they were leading me to a surprise party, It is a way to keep their preparations unaltered, but sometimes I decide not to follow them for whatever reason. Edit: Also, sometimes when unexperienced people or people that know nothing about their true will, ask for really stupid or self-harmful things, the demons will most likely tell them “yes, yes, of course I will give that to you” but nothing will happen. The reasons for them to do that are too many to be listed, but trust me, you will thank them later for doing that.

They could have just ignored saying about what the person was not prepared to know, it should be easier for the spirits than humans.
Also probably truth is about the generally accepted meaning(s) of what is said(maybe accounting for the location also), not what the other person interprets, a word can have multiple meanings, someone may deceive like this while telling the truth. Someone may use more than one language while saying, same words can have different meaning in a different language.

Also maybe it’s considered truth when someone asks you to go to a place, and you reply with I am going, but you went somewhere else, you did not mention the place when you said that.

I am not sure if context is considered in regards to truth.

[LvxMferre]

Magick is not about believing in something that is not (yet) true. It is about considering a reality that is very hard or even impossible to prove using science. It should still be relevant and true, no matter if it can be materialistically proven it should make logical sense. In my opinion, to totally disregard the logical nature of things is a huge mistake.

You can believe looking where you are going is what “they” want you to do and that gravity is a hoax, but you’ll still fall flat on your face because you didn’t see the root sticking out.