Is divination real, or at least really necessary?

General Discussion
1

Hey guys, looking into the forum I seen some people saying lot of stuff about divination and how necessary it is.

But I found myself in a doubt state about some divination stuff like tarot.

I always did divinations and they always said different stuffs. I tried tarot, runes, pendulum and buzios and always with different results. Look, I’m always cooperative with readers, never blocked anything but always with different answers. Even if when I did 3 in the same day, with different people, one after another. But divination claims to “told what’s untold” and I don’t believe that destiny can have subtle changes like that.

Question 1 is: isn’t divination just coincidence? Like you pull a card and have your answers rulled by the coincidence, not revealing your real destiny but just an aleatory card or anything like that?

Now, for the second question, think for a second: when you do an evocation (a connective one where entity talks to you directly) you can ask them directly everything about you need to do. You can also ask a demon (for example) to bring the answer to you and that will come onto your dreams for example. And then you can do whatever you’re told to do.

Like, if you wish to know if you have the possibility to live in another country you just need to call an entity that powers correspond to this matter and ask for it. When the answer comes you can plan the next steps by asking to the same spirit or another one and do whatever they say you to.

So question 2 is: even if this kind of divination is real, it’s necessary? Because if you can ask directly to an entity why try to divinate something?

Last, question 3: is divination for yes or no really necessary on an evocation?

Well, now in my beliefs I only trust on a divination when it comes to “yes or no” during an evocation. I don’t use but can easily accept. But about this other divinations, I need people to tell me what they think about before I form an opinion.

So what you think about it? I’m counting on you. :slight_smile:

2

I found that to observe something somewhat changes its outcome if you have a strong and deep emotional reaction to the divined response.

Read this, it may help you come up with your own theories, we don’t trade PDFs on here but this one is okay: The Kybalion PDF, archived link.

Also these:

2 Likes
3

That’s a great answer and explains some stuff but when you don’t have a strong reaction (or any reaction at all) to the divination, it’s possible a huge change?

Also, even if you have a huge emotional reaction to it, a completely different change is possible?

My case is the first btw but the second possibility intrigues me more now. lol.

Thanks Eva. I’m in love with this forum, learned and created a lot already.

And I’ll read this references. Thanks again. :slight_smile:

1 Like
4

The 5 Star General, muddy boots soldier and battlefield whore all divine about the future. And all get different answers! The future isn’t predestined, but there are energies. Divination allows you to appreciate and tap into these energies, using them to your advantage or crippling them before they grow.

“isn’t divination just coincidence?” Yes! That’s why various schools of divination have always existed and why there’s so many books, journals and practitioners - because it’s all just coincidence! Who would have thought?

“is divination for yes or no really necessary on an evocation?”
A resounding ‘No!’

If you wish to rely upon spiritual entities (and I have, on occasion) you’ll never achieve your own independent – ‘Why don’t you just go and fuck yourself?’ - divinity! Divination helps in achieving your own Goddesshood or Godhood.

Hope that helps.

Al.

2 Likes
5

None at all. But if it is just coincidence, and if that changes time to time, what makes divination a powerfull tool to predict things?

Using the same example you used, a general can predict things by using strategy. He takes info on the enemy, make a lot of scenarios and see the possible outcoming. That’s not divination. The purpose of it is to uncover what’s covered, I’m wrong? If that so, respectfully, coincidence it’s all we need? Can I count with coincidence in the middle of battlefield? If I can count with metaphysics entities to help me with direct answers (or, at least, omens or anything like that), and by having this answers I can make a whole bunch of strategies to win a fight, why to choose a divination method based in coincidence?

Look, that can sound like disrespect to a whole bunch of magicians who uses divinations as priority method. Even to ones who makes a living with his experiences in this area. And that’s not the case, not at all, I want to make this clear. I respect who uses, like I respect xamanists, vampirists and a sort of magicians that uses magical arts that I don’t know well or I don’t “like” (take this “like” as lacking of better word to use here), no one have nothing to do with it. But I want to learn why people have that confidence in this method and why they take it so seriously.

I’m studying Eva’s materials and another ones, and inclined to learn how to properly use tarot divination (maybe the most used) just to see why it’s so used.

Thanks for tge answer in this. :slight_smile:

But I’m not totally dependent on spiritual forces. No one can be. If you’re, you’re on a baaaaaaad situation…

There’s a relationship. Even if you’ll going to use a particular force only one time. Is a trade. You give and you get, always. It can be some offerings, like in Umbanda, or some spiritual energy, astral energy, or by giving an ear (and believe in me, there’s a lot of spirits that gives you to much wisdom just by listening to them, but that’s is another topic). Whatever it is, there’s always an exchange. Because that’s true: any entity NEEDS a channel…

Again, thanks. All that said, and if you wish, can you PM me about your divination methods and how you learned them (no need to teach me, just the background for my researches)? Thank you a lot! :smiley:

1 Like
6

I think that as a species we misunderstand the meaning of ‘coincidence’. It’s similar to the way we toss around the word ‘instinct’; it’s a way of acknowledging something extremely complex without actually understanding the mechanics of it. When events coincide, they rely on one another to make it happen, sort of a quantum entanglement of sorts. Coincidence is not synonymous with accidental. Just my opinion tho.

4 Likes
7

Maybe that’s fit on some explanations. A good point to see looking in quantum physics. Still, doesn’t makes clear if we can use divination based in coincidence as a sure thing.

Some interesting points you put here, guys, thanks a lot!

1 Like
8

interesting your post but I think you have not studied much divination, every system has its own rules and falls within its culture of affiliation so symbols or myths related to the answers also depend on this and only then can be read in a better way.
The divination has a structure to itself, it moves according to the law of synchronicity of Jung.
Also, certain to call an entity can easily make you an answer, but your mind can distort that answer and you can not control it, this could also happen with divination because a person tends to read what he would like for himself and not the true answer of the cards, for this it is said to avoid making tarot or divination in general to themselves, but to use another person if you are very involved.
These are principal imotives because it is necessary to study their symbolism very deeply and learn to be detached.
Divination can be your only way to use to start with other entities, but it can be a support especially to understand that you are not telling lies alone … for an evocation the divination is done or at least I have taught so to be sure that that spirit wants to talk to you and if the offers are adequate and usually done first for this reason, then there are those who repeat it afterwards to understand if they have accepted and if there are changes in the divination on the problem for which you called the spirit and if you can also establish a time when it should happen … you also do to understand if another offer or another call is needed before the thing is realized … usually you need to this then of course the thing can vary depending on the practitioner :slight_smile:

1 Like
9

@katia hmm, that’s a good point.

Also, I agree that maybe I didn’t studied much as you or the other members that made their points.

But before I keep going, I stated at the beginning of the topic that theese divinations I talk are that wich uses coincidence as main form of divination.

Altough I agree that are a lot of forms of divination (even with demons as I stated before), some makes me feel confused exactly because they relie on coincidence, and this is the point that pushes all the discussion to here. But you made a good point and I’ll definitely look futher.

About divination with entities, that’s a problem that I want to discuss further because I desagree in some level. Like, I use a lot of it with some demons and always had successful cases. Specially in dreams, a realm that is much more difficult to influence consciously. But again, I believe that of you have a strong bond with an entity, you’ll do not have any problem within interpretations, because it’s become more and more clear when you are working with this entities each time you do it.

Well, if you want to keep this discussion on and on, just PM me. :slight_smile:

Ps: guys, I wish to know something: can you keep up with my terrible english? Like I said sometimes, I started to use again about some months ago, didn’t use for 2 or 3 years, so I believe sometimes it’s difficult to keep up. If it is, please give me a call. Let me know it.

Thanks!

10

divination with tarot or similar it’s no coincedence it’s synchronicity it’s is a law of Jung

https://www.scribd.com/document/223463118/SYNCHRONICITY-An-Acausal-Connecting-Principle-Jung

if you dont want use it’s ok ma the divination it’s real i read tarot ad other sistem of 30 years, the cards have never been wrong …

2 Likes
11

yes, if they are entities that see the future they can help you but the future is not static it changes while you decide from time to time, both the cards and the entities can tell you the most probable situation … nothing comes what kind of relationship do you have, depends on the qualities of the spirit and if there is no censorship in your mind about what must be …

for example you love a person but that will die in a few days, your entity would like to tell you but for your mind it would be so painful that you would not understand what it tells you … and you realize it only after the death of that person that they were telling you … it’s an example a little raw but it is so, it happened to my exmarite, the channeled entities had told him that the brother would have made a big thump and that everything would be reduced to ashes … after a few months his brother fell into the bathroom because he had a heart attack was a robust person and made a loud noise falling and all his writings the wife sent them to the incinerator after his funeral …

1 Like
12

Your questions have alot of assumptions some of the biggest is that the nature of events is fixed in some way ie: what most consider the concept of destiny.

I would suggest you look into the nature of karma(the eastern concept not the catholic warped versiob of some kind of cosmic judge), dharma and wyrd if you want insight into why things are in constant flux. If ya need a starting point these have some info on all 3 if you are willing to take the time to watch um.

1 Like
13

Not law, theory, and that is much much different. Even in psychology we have a LOT of professionals who doesn’t uses Jung’s concepts at all. Altough your thoughts are very concise, and that’s beautiful to read, we need to make that clear, with all respect. It’s all about beliefs.

In fact, I believe you didn’t like my questions at some point, so I apologize and let’s move on. This is not for making people angry or be unrespectful, just for learning, so sorry if I said anything unrespectful.

1 Like
14

@Dinmiatus But I do believe that timeline is concise. I believe that events seek choices so if you don’t make any changes things will occur even if you don’t like it. I think it’s logical, btw.

But, by believing in that, I do believe that changes takes place if you do it. Magick is only one of many ways to do that.

And I also believe that you can do changes on other lifes. You can do changes whatever you want, depending only of the much you know, the power you have and the power you’ll use, all that combined.

It’s like playing with toy cars on a automatic toy road (here in Brazil we call this Autorama, don’t know how it’s called there where you live). You can let the cars take their courses or you can move one or other car if you want, manually. Whatever you do, the road is still there.

But I’ll read more about karma and dharma, even more than I did already. Maybe I come back woth some question regarding this matter.

Thank you.

1 Like
15

no no anger I simply put the link to make me understand, most of the time people do not know what I’m talking about … however, see everything is a theory of magic, physics, psychology, there is nothing certain and real, maybe math in this sense could be :slight_smile: … if a person does not want to see or believe it is his choice, chance does not exist for most people who do magic … say that my neighbor got sick after two months I made an invoice, you can see it as a coincidence, or that those who had threatened me found themselves having to transfer because he had serious problems with the police after I invoked spirits on him, or that a person after many years he found a job after I worked incessantly with different rituals to help find it … for you can be coincidences even if they happened within three months of my rituals … I do not see them as coincidences but like the results of my ritual … and so with divination … I read something in the cards and that comes true and this happens quite often for me is not a coincidence … divination reads the most probable way of how things will go, of course this thing can be changed because the destiny apart from some things changes, the magic is to increase the chances that what we want to come true is to direct the possibilities … this can happen or not depends on how much our life is influential …

2 Likes
16

No problem @katia, it was not for the link. I “sensed” it. But that’s ok.

I believe in divination. But I believe in “direct contact” in order to do so.

I believe in demons. Also I do believe in magick, and I believe that can be so powerfull that you can move destiny even it’s not about you! That’s why I’m here on forum. But I do have some concerns in believe on tarot and that’s why I’m asking for answers here.

I’ll study about it more and more and will make some other readings in order to get new conceptions about it. But as I said your points are very concise and made me start to think it in another way. I’ll look further into tarot divination without blocking anything looking for a new point lf view.

Again, thank you and sorry for getting you wrong.

1 Like
17

ask a Prince Vassago, tarot and divination are his

1 Like