We all make mistakes and have to grow. It’s incredibly admirable to see you recognize this so great job!
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@dagar Thanks for the feedback!
It’s an important topic, and I do care, so I try to update as I study.
So much content is online, and since some of it really is awful, it’s important to develop language that identifies what is what and why. It seems like the issue is less about the ethics of consenting adults seeing each other aroused and naked and more about the displacement of fantasy with reality and lack of awareness of the chemical functions occurring during sex acts. The Mind is a bit unrestricted, but the body has genuine vulnerabilities and limitations.
Basic romance reflects this, also. In our relationships, we are addicted to romance, and it might not be the healthiest thing for us.
I’m interested in moderation (ways to keep adult entertainment an active, profitable presence in society) more than abolition. Replacing pornography with erotic art might be valuable and a decent option for creators. That takes more time, resources, attention and talent though ~ so that could be why porn presents more primitively, with quick transactions like a drug dealer, rather than insightful or artistic expression. Money factors and survival strategies are also important to consider.
Erotic art draws more attention to human intimacy. That requires more time and resources, so when people are very busy, high stress, and less financially secure ~ that mixes a different cocktail more likely to create a pattern of dependency.
Last winter, I started a pathworking specifically for love and sex magick. It’s been interesting exploring the boundaries between fantasy and physical reality (and how easy it is for our brains to become addicted). It’s nudged me into a more academic corner of magick since I’ve needed more data and science to inform my judgment.
Overly fantastical ideologies that aren’t grounded in scientific reason will result in a neglect of moderation and simplicity. This inevitably creates suffering because we’re universally bound by entropy, so it’s impossible to escape our need for balance and obedience to our restrictions. That’s probably why people are obsessed with transcendence. There’s really no way to bypass entropy, but our brains have developed a unique trait called “Mind” that simulates what it might be like to bypass entropy.
Evolutionary speaking, it costs too much to deviate from our need for moderation.
Mentally, we are boundless like The Fool, so we can go there. We are not boundless in our physicality, so Minds tend to become self-defeating in what we imagine we can handle. I’ve been more focused on biology and cognitive science to help me conceptualize this better.
It’s interesting to analyze the added dimension of our private imaginations to our already chemical and forceful being. I’ll be maintaining this study and will try to get some written content on it soon. Let me know if you share more also.
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I wanted to revisit this because I made a typo and can’t edit it now. I originally said being a pimp isn’t the same as being your own boss, but I meant being an employee of a pimp isn’t the same as being your own boss. However, pimps can do a lot of good! Some workers need and enjoy a manager.
That’s no reason to say employees of pimps aren’t respectable people. If you are accepting payment for sex work, you’re no better than the workers. Your shameful views of sex work pushes you closer to the filth-bags involved in human trafficking. You admit to treating people like property. That’s solipsistic and sociopathic. It’s bullying.
You could go to some therapy sessions and figure out why you’re so esteemed by putting people down. I highly doubt any healthy person employed by you would tolerate being dehumanized. Sex work itself isn’t dehumanizing. There are high quality pimps that treat their employees well and value their mental health. Those pimps know their employees deserve loving relationships despite the type of work occurring. Many sex workers have spouses and children, happy families. You don’t have to understand or approve it for that to be a fact.
I’m not doing sex work, camming or OF anymore, but I still love sex work and support sex workers. I’m about to start doing boudoir again and some burlesque classes. I’m happy that if I ever got in an emergency, I could utilize sex work for income easily. I’ll never be hungry. On a minor scale, prostitution also occurs if you have sex just to make your partner happy or because they are your spouse and pay the bills.
I can’t make sense of how you earn profit from sex work while degrading the people who pay your bills. It’s not even the kinky type of sadism. It’s straight up malice. You have double standards and an abusive way of viewing people. That’s part of the reason I left this forum for a little while and why the sex work industry is so dangerous. I hate frameworks like yours and would hate to consider you a friend. I don’t like sharing space with people like you, but this isn’t my forum and call to make.
Even though I decided prostitution and escorting is both too boring and dangerous and not worth the money for my interests and routines, it’s mentalities like this that put sex workers at risk. Having sex isn’t dangerous. Accepting payment for sex isn’t dangerous. What’s dangerous is abuse and treating people less than human. It’s nobody elses fault that you don’t know what intimacy is or think that sex work isn’t a valid form of intimacy when it’s between consenting, adult parties.
So much profittable work and innovation can be done in the sex work industry, but it starts with respecting the work and workers. You’re not ever going to be the innovative pimp who changes the game. You’re closer to a deviant and criminal, lazy and a hostile bum too good to get your hands dirty.
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We are all in search of pleasure… when pleasure becomes intrusive and illusionary, that is when a problem is created. Pornography is an example of a specifically toxic industry, with toxic followers, toxic participators, a disgusting undertone, and a complete degradation of nature at its most extreme. A massive industry full of people who do nothing but commodify lust for the sake of it and no other purpose cannot be anything less than toxic.
Enjoying the sexual content is not the problem - sexual content is important in regards to iconography - but, becoming clouded by said content in a counter intuitive way is a certain problem. And many will fail to admit this.
Watching it to satiate a desire for it definitely is an unnecessary energy drain. This is an objective truth.
Watching internet porn for sigil magick is laughably idiotic. “Chaos magicians” cope harder.
Why use porn?
Strengthen your third eye until you can fulfill your sexual fantasies mentally if you want to bring magic into it so bad… Why use stabilisers when you can just learn to cycle quicker and more efficiently? Why use a crutch when you are capable of running if you just try?
-Lotan Vovin
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This has drifted way off the topic of magick. Closing while I see if I can clean this up any.
Update: Never mind. The OP went off topic into a mundane discussion on porn a long time ago, then politics, and now sex work. The original OPs are no longer here to continue. Thread will stay closed and, owing to it’s off topic AND political comments, unlisted.
Please try to remember this is a MAGICK forum, people?
@ladybhex and @Titan.M If you wish I can copy out your part to a PM stub for you to continue your personal conversation. Let me know.
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