Angels, yazatas, Ahura Mazda, spentas, pentacles, psalms have helped me a lot and almost always work. On the contrary, Goetic demons and Satan work on their whim, money I got from demons had strings attached. The close friend who gave the money later said was loan and I have to give it back
Working to the forum 
Please pop over to the introductions thread and reading to the into questions to let us know your experience and what brings you here.
So what was the question? If you try the search you’ll find prime who both s hate this experience and those who don’t, and those with mixed experiences.
Mostly it seems dependent on the expectations you do in with. The very fact that you call them white and black colors your energy and interactions. You are the operator, what you believe is what you get.
This means you did it to yourself. If you will not exercise emotional control to the point that you are swayed by the hearsay of the enemies on an entity, then it’s not going to be ideal for you to work with that entity. Stick with the ones you see as “white” for the best outcomes.
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That’s not true. I used to think many as powerful demons who would surely help me. But I have finally managed to climb out of the illusions conjured by those on the dark paths and see what they are [EVIL] and what harm they have done to me. Alas the harm can’t be reversed now
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I also found this to be true. Peope are provoked and tempted to actions stronger and stronger by these Qliphothic spirits. Then they’re told “they made the decision. They did it to themselves.” But there is a very clear, conscious involvement where entities are actively pushing people to do it. A game of technicalities. Pressuring people to do things, then telling them “well they did it.” That’s blatant exploitation, and both humans and spirits do it for their own pleasure or benefit.
The qabalist angelic forces never did that. They actually encouraged me to act more virtuously and stop injustice, while demons will take payment to help anyone, even people who are clearly being unethical backstabbers.(even towards other spirits) Infernal spirits cam also network.
If you want positivity and productivity, deal with the positive and constructive polarity. If you want destruction or manipulation, call upon the negative polarity. Frankly, the distinction is very clear.
Yahweh preserves the collective longevity of Israel (Jews) while destroying those who stand against it. The qliphothic infernal do the opposite.
@Mulberry
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People say this but the details are either never given,
What is exactly being trashed of here? What technicalities?
This is my point: I don’t use this dualistic system that labels these entities as “demons “ And expects them to have to be forced to work
If you don’t aporiach them from this policy then there’s never an issue.
My position stand that the problem is the magician not the entity. These entities predate the wyavskah and many are gods and never were “evil demons” to start with.
They are not mostly of any kind of jci-imposed polarity.
Solomonic techniques are paranoid and poisoned with JCI attitudes, it’s exactly why I don’t use them.
You get what you expect. You expect that they must be forced and they’ll try to get you, so they do.
You’re not even teasing then as people, as sovereign entitues with the ability to say no. Look at it from their point of view…
You are treating them as an enemy. If you did to me, I’d find every way to sabotage the work you enslaved and tortured me into doing as well. And I wouldn’t consider myself a bad person or “black” for doing that. My aim would be to make sure you hated me so I never heard from you again.
“The only obligation of a prisoner is to escape.”
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I think demons very well can cause bad experiences sure. However, they’re not “evil”. Good and evil are human concepts and spirits don’t care about them nor can they be defined by them.
Maybe you just resonate with the angelic and lighter forces more, and that’s completely fine. If you’re working with any spirit, you need to know how to set your boundaries and maintain that you’re in control. You may have more leeway with angelics due to their perspective and the way their energy works being different to infernals, but so long as you work with them correctly you wouldn’t have any issues working with either.
Plenty of people claim terrible experiences with angels, demons, deities, and hell even servitors and not to victim blame but the bare minimum to do is to learn spiritual hygiene and protection, learn the dynamics of working with these spirits properly so that you’re in control, and work on your own power simultaneously. Lots of spirits will try take advantage of you otherwise if you don’t assert and know how to protect yourself, including some of the demons. You need to go in seeking results and not care for any of the fluff otherwise, and state your objectives clearly. There’s a reason the golden dawn have initiates do the LBRP daily for a year before progressing.
If you want, next time work with them in a system that has more protections built-in so you have more leeway. Carl Spartacus’ Goetia illustrated a good start.
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Everything is perception, it is the half full half empty effect.
As above so below, as I believe the world to be so it is.
In boot camp and infantry school, those who thought it was to hard to do… manifested that and dropped out. Even more so in Special forces training.
Those who adopted the identity of (“this is what it takes to be a Marine, then this is what I do”) succeeded, because they believed they could and set the intention to do it.
I’ve heard people cry out to God on deployment. Hell I’ve heard people cry out to Alah, Krishna and even Satan when the bullets are flying. And each one of them will say their belief is the reason they’re here today.
You don’t attract what you want, you attract what you are and you are what you choose to identify as, good or bad.
Set your intentions, your vibration to what you want to achieve and you will have no choice but to become it.
It’s magic, it’s magic with an extra K, it’s science, it’s energy, it’s whatever you need to call it to make it work but what works works.
To add to the contrary I have the exact same views on my personal gnosis as the author of this threas but IN REVERSE. Why? Because I allow MY experience to dictate my beliefs similar to how ones belief that black magick is somehow in effective or comes with strings dictates theirs
But I’ve seen little 14 year old girls die because they’ve been forced to hold a pit viper to prove they have the holy Spirit. I’ve seen friends forced into conversion therapy and shock treatment for the will of God, and then I’ve seen countless people persecuted, and executed unlawfully in deployment data briefs because they thought they were carrying out “gods will”. This has led to me having very bad encounters with angels and so called beings of light because I’ve seen these taylored “Good” spirits to evil things, monstrous things and then use people. Attack the weak, and uplift the immortal as if it was righteous. So my experience is a complete flip flop.
So when I approach the dark spirits and those of black magick, I get brilliant success with no strings attached, I get multitudes of blessing, prosperity, financial freedom and health because I go into it BELIEVING it will work.
I approach the dark spirits how a light Practitioner approaches the light because I’ve seen the evil in the light and the righteousness in the dark. That’s why my magick always works.
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Well I mean you got part of the truth down pat. But there is a reason your getting the results you have been given and your type of comment is very telling where you exist in the heirarchy, and what sort of intents you have.
In the magickal systems, White Entities essentially represent potential that hasn’t fully been realized (manifested) as they exist on a higher level. Some individuals propose that have the high ground are more powerful or whatever non-sense, but you will notice such individuals constantly fighting and being cornered unless they have alot of extra help.
Black Magick of the Darkness (Qlippothic levels…but Qlippoth is only a niche of The Darkness… one way of working with it) is Physical Satanic Power. It is basically drawing down Divine Light from the White Levels (and from White Entities), and giving it real satanic physical power by binding it in a position of Darkness.
Understanding and using both is key, because they complement each other. The reason you have not received much help from Demonic forces, is because you really do not align that well with already established Power Structures in the Real World.
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That all depends on the operator’s level of development
Me personally, I have experienced excellent results from Angels as well as the Daemonic
Your manifestations feed off your energy in order to come to life. Whatever expectations you carried with you into the ritual, you are bound to manifest just that. If in your mind, you carry the expectation of string attached, then you are creating such. I said that because daemons tend to have a bad rap in today’s society, it is common for new comers to approach these being with all type of negative expectations without realizing they are bringing those energies into their work and their manifestations
Try remove all conceive notions of angels or daemons, and enter the ritual with a blank/empty vessel carry only your truest intents - I promise, you will start seeing things different
Not arguing nor denying your experience per se, what I would add tho is it all depends on the practitioner, their spiritual development, their relationship with that said entity and how grounded they are within their practice
What was your intents during those rituals? Were there any subconscious fears? What were your expectations while performing those money ritual(s)?
Also, black… white…? What are those? To me, there exist only one force and that is darkness for all even the light cam from darkness. Darkness is the womb and source of all creation. As you were taping into that source, you were thereby bringing into life your intentions and desires. If you approach this force with fears, you are bound to manifest nightmares into your life, just be careful
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Evil is an illusion, it all depends on perspective. Id say a person who is truly evil does things he knows are wrong in his own personal perspective for personal gain (Ironic considering i do that sometimes).
Demons help you to grow by destroying what is blocking you from your goals internally, this can cause insanity or death depending on the extent of traumas, and emotional baggage the person has and how they’re dealing with it.
Its not the demons fault for doing what you asked if you are unprepared for the potential consequences because of your own disregard for proper preperation.
On the other hand, if you arent working with them to improve yourself to get what you want out of life then they are more unwilling to help you. You cant help those who are unwilling to help themselves. That causes money, in this case, to come from places where it can and if it can only come from places where people will LEND you the money then thats where it will come from.
Also, i find it quite funny that your dishing shade on demons when you have one of their names as your username. No judgement there, just an observation.
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Binary definitions don’t help with magic. Nor does shoehorning entities into labels
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There is a different between apply pressure to grow stronger and something which is necessary; and plain self sabotage living with actively toxic influences and trying to stay positive about it.
Having been in the Army Infantry myself, I stuck it out for the contract, but I also realized there is MUCH more money and stability to be made elsewhere.
You can choose to think infernal spirits bring a lesson with them, or you can admit there are better energies to deal with for growing abundance on a solid foundation. (Also learn the necessary lessons in other more beneficial places)
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This however is your experience. I have had the complete opposite as in the Qliphothic demonic forces pushing me to act more virtuously and stop injustice whilst angels took payments to help the unethical.
And whilst I agree with your quote here:
Understand that everything is experience based and my experience is that the demonic has been more on the positive and constructive, whilst the Angelic tend to want destruction (baptism in fire) or be more manipulative which I consider the negative polarity.
In conclusion what you and I are experiencing is a clear example of the “As above so below” principle.
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On the contrary Binary systems can… however so can nonbinary. Just very different gnosis that both carry their own benefits.
Binary tends to promote one sidedness, polarity, and isms.
Nonebinary comes with drawback though just as well. You have to empty your cup before you can fill it.
And you can’t truly understand something until you’ve fully embraced it and put it into practice (filling your cup with it).
I recommend trying both. Use the binary and let the pendulum swing. Then empty your cup and fill it completely with a none polarized no attachment openness that renders polarity unnecessary.
Then see which one works best for you. Because there’s no such thing as reality, just everyones perception of it. That’s why I always encourage personal gnosis and owning your own divinity, taking what works.
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I disagree, binary systems constrain when there are stages of gray
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Just because there are layers of gray doesnt take away the fact that there is black and white at the complete opposing ends.
There is both duality and non-duality existing at the same time and both are as true as eachother.
I view grey as a lie we tell our selves to keep us anchored in the here and now and comfortable. It’s a present state of being that’s favorable to our homeostasis as an organism.
The truth is we’re in an infinite spectrum in both directions regarding anything moral, physiological or metaphysical and it’s pretty biased to say we’re anything close to the center or the “grey”.
But maybe all the positives and negatives come together at a zero somewhere??? But who’s to say where that is.
I realize you find more freedom with the infernal. The only thing is, it’s clear you have a distrust towards angels because of the corrupt actions of humans. You wouldn’t blame the infernals for it, so why associate angels with it?
I find that hypocritical of the LHP crowd. And frankly, I’ve had angels more willing to help without ulterior motives than demons.
I’ve noticed with LHP people, they think angels are static and halt evolution. And that is SO far from the truth. Angels prize conquest of obstacles and growth, but they aren’t self serving, vampiric black sun entities. (Angels also disfavor people like that)
As a whole, growth is better done with expansion, not the vampiric energies of death. If only LHP people could get past the distrust of “the light”.
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Your issue is not that LHP people are hypocritical. It’s that your stuck in a paradigm of “oh my ways right and your ways wrong because its mine and therefore I must preach to convey it lest I lose my sense of security.”
If your referring to “light” as anything Abrahamic then I challenge you to find the “light” in the Infernal, otherwise it’s just more polarized thinking enforced by Christian otherness.
But demons are just Gods from other cultures that found their divinity just fine without a mainstream religion coming in, stamping them out with force and then shouting “ours is right yours is wrong”.
To me your angels are demons and my demons are angels🤷‍♀️
But if I came in here preaching “YOUR GODS AND ANGELS ARE DEMONS” like abrahamists, we wouldn’t get very far would we???
Thus I stick to the “right handed” labeling for sake of communication. "God forbid " Abrahamic religions get treated with the same otherness they convey. That’s the “REAL” hypocrisy.
Time to bring the thread back on topic.
@Mulberry I may need help with this one.
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You aso forgot to add the actions of ANGELS and the Abrahamic demiurge. I’ve had angels threaten innocent beings to try and bring me back to Christianity, heck I’ve even got death threats from the God of Abrahamic religions. I just fire back with “all loving huh? Nice try…”
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