What Our Community Needs Is Unity!

What Our Community Needs Is Unity!… We Were All New At Some Point!… We Should Be Helping People Elevate And Learn Rather Than Putting Them Down!!!

The Occult, Magick & Spiritual communities can be a harsh and unforgiving place. This applies even more when it comes to newcomers. From the harsh judgmental attitudes of “community veterans” to the narrow linear views of the dogmatic pathwalkers, our community as it stands today is full of bickering, infighting and segregation. In the age where we can communicate with other thousands of miles away with the click of a button you would think our world would be unified. The sad truth is that we are further from unity than potentially ever before. Society and civilization has broken into an endless cycle, a trap, a prison that we have allowed ourselves to create. With the loss of debate and proper dialog many new content creators, experience sharers and vocally new practitioners are often insulted, pushed aside and attacked, simply because of their inexperience and naivete.

I believe it is important for us to acknowledge that we were all inexperienced and naive once. We were all once new to magick, spirituality and the occult. Yet it seems in our current day we are less willing to give the new, inexperienced folks a chance. We expect them to step through the door as experts. Almost an expectation for them not to speak until they have mastered all the secrets of the universe. Truth is many of the people in our community don’t want to give anyone a chance. Most cannot accept the vocalization of the new and yet the only way for these people to grow is to allow their work, experiences and thoughts to be gazed upon under the lens by those who do in fact know better.

We have created these unwritten rules that are enforced by folk whose personality I can only describe as hardened stone. They are so set in their ways that they will not shift… set in stone pardon the pun. These rules are commonly found and tend to be along the lines of, don’t make any content, videos, posts or comments on something you haven’t got years of experience in. Another is that youtube, blogging and any other form of public vocal expression is not for newcomers. Usually these rules are enforced by attacking verbally, character assassination and of course slander. It would seem are open minded, spiritually evolved community lacks the ability to give anyone a chance to make something of themselves and learn.

Now of course this doesn’t apply to every single person, but everyone will know of someone that this refers to. We seem to have forgotten that it is naivete and mistakes are what allows me to grow. We forget that professionalism, delivery and content take time to develop as to the qualities we have. I look at the first blog articles I wrote, the first videos I produced, and I think, wow… this is terrible. Yet I also acknowledge that it was because of my persistence and continued production that my talents grew and became refined. Again, I acknowledge the distance they still have to go. Nobody gave me a chance in my first days… but I wish they did. That is what we as a community need to do. Instead of putting newcomers down, pushing them aside and trying to break their want to continue, we could direct them on how to be better. Give advice and constructive criticism instead of insults. Aid them in progressing and evolving rather than trying to stamp out any potential they may have.

As Much As We Can Aid The Community In Its Growth Those Trying To Progress Have To Meet Us Half Way!…

There is however another side to this. There are some creators who cannot take criticism in any fashion. They cannot see the line between judgmental insult and helpful criticisms. This is something they too need to work on. The community has to meet each other half way and bring unity to our people. We have the ability to share experiences, teach what we know and aid in each other’s growth. Instead of debating semantics and bickering about different perspectives we could all be bouncing ideas, and vocalizing our expressions. Refining each other’s practice and gnosis. True ascent for us will be when the community stands together as one.

For too long have we put others down who don’t deserve it. There are some people who deserve to be called out… but that is not the majority. If someone has the desire to be vocal let them, and allow their words to be heard and considered. Even if that means criticizing it. Our creators have to allow their voices to be challenged and questioned. This is how we grow. We cannot have unity when we build walls to shut people out. We cannot be unified when we don’t give people a chance to become. We are all student, we were all knew, and progression always starts at square one. Just because some of us are higher on the progression chart, doesn’t mean those below us are worth less. We have a responsibility to see this community grow… so I will ask you this. Do you want this community to grow? Or is this community only for your elite?

Stay True & Stay Awesome

Asbjorn Torvol


As much as I’m a person who believes that growing requires pain, I think that it’s all too often a newcomer to any art of magic becomes overwhelmed by expectations and judged for their lack of knowledge. It’s happened to me more than once and I’ve learnt the hard way that you really have to do your research if you want to be invested in the workings. And to not take every word for granted.

Some days I feel like I work harder on obtaining occult knowledge than I do on writing an essay… that’s the other thing; beginners might find it easy to become obsessed with knowledge and power. I agree we should also support people, but it’s important that in addition to supporting their growth, we should support them to keep them balanced in life and not to spiral out of control by using magic as a drug to over-fix their problems. Even I sometimes have to slap my wrist to read my textbook instead of grimores at times.

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There are plenty of enemies of magick. So yes, we need to realize that we are a family. At the same time, I think it’s OK to realize that some of us are too different from one another in terms of core beliefs to be able to fully have harmony. For example, if one group believes that entities are real and exist apart from the human mind, but another basically believes that the supernatural does not truly exist, that’s a nearly insurmountable difference for many folks. In that scenario, maybe it’s best just to go separate ways.

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I don’t know I hardly ever go into the governmental threads I know somethings gonna piss me off in them haha!
So I just stay away.

I think Lady Eva does a good job helping new ones out in here. I think she goes above and beyond the call of duty here. I truly hope BALG appreciates her work and time.
And most of us are willing to share our experiences and help others learn.
But helping dosent mean hold their hand and do it for them.
Magick and especially black Magick is a lot of hard work. You have to put in the time and the work.
There is no way around it.

And joining a black magiclans site should let you know there will be controversial stuff going on …black Magick itself is controversial.

And sometimes the only way you are gonna level up or move to another place is to face some heat.

No I do not support racial bullshit on any level.
That’s just not cool no matter what.
But that dosent mean I don’t have a right to express my concerns over things happening to my race, gender, sexual preference whatever.

I was/am in BDSM. I should have the right to do that if I want to. And if want to do that with Azazel, well that’s mine and his business.
But for inquiring minds no we are not in that relationship anymore. But we are just as close as ever.

There will be someone somewhere that is going to challenge you , as a person, as a magicIan …better to get the schooling in here. And be ready for it. Because if the right one comes across to you it’s gonna take all you got to fight back. I should know.

So unity and peace and love is all fine and dandy but you cannot learn the harsher lessons being cuddled all the time. Your gonna have to take some criticism and your gonna have to take some struggle and your gonna have to learn to think two steps ahead. And be prepared for shit to get real from time to time because it’s gonna happen, in here and out there. It just is.

And is this about the whole sumnus dreadwood thing?


i think Asbjorn is basically right, however i elect to play the role of the harsh taskmaster who will not forsake the TRUTH of the lesson. if i see something that will not only trip up the poster, and all those who read such a post, i will call it out. opinions be damned! if i and the spirits that are constantly possessing me do not find a problem, then i shall remain silent. (or if its just too stupid to acknowledge…like racism)


It’s a person. …long story…Sorry that question wasn’t directed at you.

And yes best advice just avoid the topics that will mostly upset you.
you will probably run into it some anyway but not nearly as much. I will say most everyone here does keep the political stuff and the other difficult topics to just a few threads.


Just a passing observation that bullying, insults (whether racially linked or otherwise) and newbie-bashing are NEVER tolerated on here, and that not only is that enforced by moderation (though it seldom arises) but also, the overall culture of the board is one of live and let live, clarified in the welcome statement penned by Timothy here, and given life by the active majority of members on here who form the board’s overall culture and tone.

We actively enforce rules against insults and disrespecting other members and their quest for ascent and power, and in addition to that, we have member-moderation, in the form of every single pair of eyes, because all members can use the flagging function if they or another member are insulted or abused.

Anyway, I took @asbjorntorvol’s OP as being about the wider state of the magickal community, not this forum, and on that topic of the wider world, I tend to agree with all the points here, except for the troubling word “unity”! :thinking:

While (I think) I understand what Asbjorn means, that an absence of backstabbing and a little more mutual support amongst people like us, who many rather powerful lobbies would like to see silenced or dead, would be helpful, this concept of making “unity” paramount is beloved of would-be prophets and cult-leaders!

Aka, those who want to lead a mass of sheep, eagerly policing each other for thoughtcrimes, stamping out individuality and free-thinking, and who violently silence anything that challenges their precious groupthink.

I’m certain that’s not what Asbjorn’s about, but the concept leads so readily towards it that I had to have my say.

For that reason, personally I’d go with tolerance, which means tolerating (not approving of, but neither, attempting to eradicate, invalidate, or shout down) the views and practices of fellow occultists which one happens personally not to share, as a healthy model for the wider community, as it has been on here.

Magick – if it’s not to become mere religion, or cultlike – is about experimentation, about peer-review, and about no concept being off-limits for rational exploration, and as such, feathers will be ruffled from time to time, corns stepped upon, and sacred cows tipped over – this is healthy, natural, and the foundation stone of freedom.

From Odin’s solitary quests to Set, wandering in the desert; from The Fool to The Hermit of Tarot, through the history of glorious lunatics that we read and speak of today, conscious conformity and limiting oneself to the then-contemporary morals has never been the hallmark of the magician.

And these are not traits compatible with unity in any group: they are the chaos element, the disruptor, the outsider. Which is what the world needs on a regular basis!

Individuality and freedom (and personal power) never sit well with calls to value unity above all else, because if unity becomes the only thing that matters, then the nail that sticks out MUST be hammered down, lest that unity be disturbed. :cop:

Is that REALLY where we want to go, when “Hoe your own row, and let me hoe mine in equal freedom” could prevent such a thing?

All kinds of freedoms are under constant attack, online and off, and it’s almost always conducted under a mask of benevolence, for the greater good, for the children, and so on. :thinking:

So, IMO, on this topic, we have to be very careful we never let the new boss (of our internal landscapes, at least) resemble the old boss we work so hard to overthrow!


Uhggghhhh! Enough with the frigging race crap already! We multi racial multi cultural people are tired of it already, it’s time to stop. The only time racial controversy comes up is when it’s someone complaining about a political opinion they don’t like that often has nothing whatsoever to do with race. I personally have never experienced any sort of uncomfortable racist or prejudiced sentiment here on balg. The only time I have ever seen it has been from individuals using race as a means to obscure a political view for the purpose of promoting their own political philosophy.
I just don’t buy into the crap, sorry not as many people are racist as you may want to believe and it’s only conveniently thrown around for political leverage I’m just sick of it. :expressionless:
Now just so everyone can be clear on it, criticism of a particular religious belief be it Christian Muslim or Jewish, is not racist it’s simply criticism of a belief. If you think it’s racist you need to stop and rethink your views on reality because you could be brainwashed and not know it. We are a family here regardless of race and only trouble makers bring it up as some kind of supremacist problem/issue.


5 posts were split to a new topic: Moralisindg, Dissent, And Constructive Criticism

I agree with you 500% Unity would make us more whole as a BALG family.

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Well, this is a black magick forum where controversial topics of various kinds are discussed, and as a result, there are going to be people here whose personal opinions and worldviews may not sit well with those used to being spoofed pabulum on social media, and shielded from anything that may cause offence.

Frankly, you’ll find stronger language in the Bible, Torah, and Qu’ran! Not to mention the Vedas…

Policing what people say about offline matters is a slippery slope: obviously, if ANYONE addresses a member on here with an ethnic slur, that’s a matter for moderation, the same as any insult, but saying “All Christians are fools” or similar umbrella remarks about a whole population, cracking down on that is a damned slippery slope, one that’s fucking up whole sections of the internet right now, and it’s dangerous to facilitate or encourage the creeping spread of censorship under the mask of benevolence and creating “safe spaces” to flourish on here.

It starts with one concession, but before you know it, you can’t post asking for a death curse because that’s bullying and abusive, you can’t post asking for a demon to help you get off a traffic offense because someone was in a car crash and feels triggered, meanwhile someone read the “get my ex back” section and is literally shaking at the idea anyone would help someone like that, because they were stalked or left an abusive relationship… it never ends.

If you want to call which groups get special protection from anything that may offend them, then the case can (and will) be made that to not protect another group, by censorship of anything they may find “problematic,” is discriminatory… that’s how the madness begins to spread.

And a forum on the subjects this one covers is ripe for being pruned down to vacuous tosh, by steadily tightening the net on what may offend or upset another person who happens to be passing by.

That’s not the route to some kind of greater respect, it’s the pathway to censorship and thought-policing - the exact suffocating kind of conformity and control I described in my post above.

Unity by removing words anyone may dislike, opinions that may cause offence to anyone, and by steadily making the forum match a very specific and restrictive set of values, bedded down in victimhood, isn’t wholesome support and respect - it’s a straightjacket.

If you want to start flagging anything that could offend anyone, dating back to the forum’s origins in 2012, you’re going to have your work cut out for you, because damn near every post on here could be interpreted as assisting in some “axis of oppression,” or causing offence to some group, or making someone feel disrespected because they share demographic traits or whatever the hell… get over it.

Contrary to current fixations, the world is not full of victims needing white knights, and anyone on this forum who gets deterred from black magick just because of words on a screen, well they’re in for one hell of a ride when they meet an actual demon, or have their sanity and sense of self put to the test through pathworkings and initiatory experiences.


As a Black man, I can’t recall ever experiencing racism on occult forums (whether BALG or any other forum).

Now, I have a number of times (outside of BALG) been accused of “Islamophobia” or “racism” for criticizing Islam…

As for the political threads, there are only a few of them here, and some of them may also be working threads (group magickal action towards a certain goal). Discussion in those threads are usually civil.

There used to be some flame wars on BALG, but ever since Lady Eva took over as moderator and stricter rules were established, it’s usually been quite peaceful.


I disagree, but I’m not about to write an ebook about it. I’ll just follow the rules here and move along. Knowing how free the forum is, is a good thing, now I know I don’t have to be so civil.

Yeah I’m with you there I’ve been called an islamaphobe. I don’t really care because if a religio-political system like Islam is fundamentally opposite of such a large segment of what we in this country feel is acceptable and enables individual freedom then it’s your duty to call it out.
The human race has been fumbling around trying to figure it’s self out since the beginning. Just when we started to finally get ourselves sorted this came into play and it has to be dealt with. When you go to a country looking to be part of what it is you are welcome but when you enter into this country with the intent of making like yours you have got to go because that’s invasion and conquest and I’m not going to let em do that on my watch.

Exactly. What’s it matter? In the end, your skin will do nothing. It’s so limiting. Barbaric.
(The below is in general, not directed)
I agree, perhaps one day, we can put our differences aside, regardless of race. To continue to fight like this is only an insult to our siblings, ancestors and friends. But alas, people limit themselves.


Yes, you are totally right. If we behave otherwise, thriving on self exaltation, hiding pretense secrets, condemning any practice that not our own… we are simply committing the same mistakes the established religions got used to.
LHP followers already have to face so much hostility from society, it is plainly stupid to raise internal strife.


Well said. +1


I haven’t noticed too much negativity in fact I noticed the opposite. But yes I’m down for expanding new ideas and growth


Very interesting…