Well it SOUNDS good but I disagree also on the same grounds as @Dankquanicus.
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I personally wouldn’t waste time on the golden dawn material. Crowley’s thelema…mmmmm maybe.
There was a recent case here on Balg of a failing magician who kept going back to the golden dawn material like it was a light that would lead him out of darkness. Sadly that didn’t happen for him. I’ve never seen a real, true, powerful adept come from working with that current. Yes there have been but I’ve never personally seen it.
Bardons system of hermetic spiritual development is very much in line with what you’re talking about and I worked it about half way through. Another balg member I know worked his entire book one through and this young man is a phenomenal practicioner.
This is just my 2 cents is all.
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I agree as well. There has been a forced esotericsm in the last century or a little more, to things that was actually meant to be straightforward.
We are talking about a time where the geniuses didn’t know as much as an average high school student of today.
However if this philosophers stone could be created for good, is something out of my depth as an answer and out of topic I guess as well. But they tried, no doubt on that.
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I don’t believe in this concept myself, as in, there’s no such thing as real death. What I call the second death is the Taoist view that this is when you leave the energy body and you rise through the Bardos. The spirit is eternal can cannot die.
This one depends on your worldview.
Not really. That’s a corruption I think, Jesus said god is within. He had found his god within, so they became one, and that is what all should do. Find the god within to find Jesus, but Jesus is “the finger pointing the way to the moon, not the moon”.
You might like to read the books Life and Teaching of the Masters of the Far East, I assumed it was about Taoism, and I got is as it was recommended by Vermilion in his book on Kryst (which might be Christ spelled funny 
), but it’s actually all about learning from Indian immortals who used the teachings of Jesus.
I don’t personally agree with everything in this but then I never do, here’s a lot of food for thought for sure.
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I think this falls extremely close to the myth of progress. Many of these practitioners were far beyond many occultists today in both knowledge and practice.
But i agree with the straightforwardness of their material. But in the case of Astral High Magick, for example, the authors had the confidence to reveal these things because they know only the experienced of knowledgable would be able to understand the instructions in the first place, and this has not changed.
You probably saw this before but it seems to fit with the theme here …
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I agree. It seems like training methods passed down from teacher to student have gotten greatly dilluted by the modern world.
Most of us today are just blindfolded in the dark trying to make sense of what’s been passed down to us.
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That is ok to disagree, we all have different backgrounds of magick and visions of what is what. As far as I have seen in my studies of the history of magick, symbolic interpretation became widely used from the moment paganism was banned and deemed illegal in Europe which was the same time Christianity took over, around 392 AD. Magick was still widely condemned in the period of the renaissance/the time of Agrippa during the revival of Hermeticism. He himself was persecuted numerous times for heretic practices, therefore in combination with other information I have on the inner alchemical process, I do not take all his writings literal as it was simply dangerous to write not in a symbolic way in those days.
Not trying to hijack or anything I just enjoy writing about this subject.
In Dzogchen, to my understanding, one of the ideas is to cultivate constant, continuous mindfulness of heightened power throughout waking and sleeping.
The idea is that if you are not aware as you pass into sleep, it is unlikely that you will be aware as you pass into death. If you are consistently aware in dream, then perhaps you will become aware in the intermediate Bardo state, or what some would call Purgatory. The idea with all this is that you need to be aware and mindful in the bardo to not be controlled by previous karmic traces and to attain liberation in the bardo to leave the samsaric cycle of life and death. Put in Western terms, you have to be aware in Purgatory, where you go after death, regardless, to control whether you enter a Heavenly realm or return to the material plane, which I would say is a sort of Hell-plane, but in some ways also Heavenly. Perhaps these terms are too obfuscated and bogged down in watered down religious propaganda nonsense, which is why I tend to favor Eastern terminology for this. More investigation is required here and I need more direct experience.
I’m still coming to understand all the Dzogchen terms and concepts, but generally speaking with any spiritual tradition or set of practices the idea with this sort of “high magick” awakening type stuff is to peel away layers of corruption until you return to fundamental God-essence, which is your true nature.
You can see these sorts of concepts in Enochian magick much more plainly than in other angelic magick, in my opinion, and you tend to see more of it in Vajrayana Buddhist texts than in demonic magick oriented texts.
You also hear various different philosophies about all this with RHP and LHP types. You could say that RHP philosophy is about attaining unity with God-consciousness and leaving the material world by being liberated from samsara (cyclic suffering) and reincarnation, although many RHP practitioners take vows pledging to limit themselves from full attainment until all beings can achieve awakening. You could say that LHP philosophy is about using the power that can be attained from knowing your God-essence to live in the material world as an individual being.
If we’re gonna talk about it then I suppose I’ll say what I really think. My goal is something like both of these. Attain liberated consciousness and the ability to exist beyond samsara while also being able to exist in the material as a separated entity. I combine Buddhist/Dzogchen and related practices and doctrines with Western magick, such as Enochian, and I believe this to be a fruitful way to work.
I am sometimes wary of using Western JCI terms due to so much bullshit being propagated by capital T The and various churches corrupting the concepts. The idea of “faith and works” is a good example. You need “faith” that this is possible. I would say you need proof of magickal results. You need to “do works” to enter Heaven. To some this means going to church and splashing holy water on yourself, maybe donating some cash, maybe trying to “be moral,” maybe saying your Our Fathers and Hail Marys. I would say it is more about doing sophisticated practices such as ritual magick, like the priests kind of do at mass (mind control spells), and meditation and the like. Eating consecrated bread probably does something, but I am skeptical of that if you are not the one to do the invocation yourself.
All of this information is out there, especially these days, with many previously secret texts and commentaries now available for the public. That is how I got educated. If that hadn’t happened, I imagine I would have found my way to a monastery at some point.
The difference between religious people and practitioners shouldn’t be surprising. Most people just can’t be fucked to do basically anything beyond a shallow depth of bare survivability, no matter how intelligent they may or may not be. I’ve met some truly stupid people on the path to becoming doctors. They are just good at memorizing stuff in books and memorizing math processes, usually through brute force. There is very often very little self-reflective or truly critical thought devoid of emotionally biased thinking in people, not to mention an absolute lack of mindful awareness, meaning that they believe everything that arises in their mind is “them,” “their thoughts,” “their ideas,” “their identity,” rather than recognizing all appearances as empty phenomenon devoid of substance. Put simply, they’re fucking stupid fuck-faces who are controlled by ego. Doctors (yes, the MDs and the Ph.D.s) and engineers tend to be the stupidest and fuck-faceiest precisely because of ego, although there are many people with an astounding lack of knowledge and minds riddled with lies, shallow entertainment, and incessant bouncing boinging pinging notificating distraction, and most of all fear in the form of weakness, the greatest plague which has ever infected and controlled humanity.
That’s not me saying, I’m so smart, look at me, that is my observation. I believe part of The Great Work is to rid yourself of all the shit that modern society and humanity tries to thrust on you forcibly and without your consent. Otherwise, the peace and tranquility required to know your true God-consciousness, and just to enjoy your normal life, is not possible.
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Many occultists openly expressed the existence of the Pagan Gods in their works, and this was fine, as this is part of Neoplatonic Philosophy, they did not get into trouble for this.
Marsilio Facino in his Three Books of Occult Philosophy goes into detail on creating various talismans, and he was a Catholic Priest, and this brought no trouble on him. What did bring some attention to him was his philosophical beliefs.
What is considered magick in the Renaissance is a complicated matter. Talismans were generally fine, and Geomancy was widely practiced, even the Vice Legate of the Catholic Church practiced this during the later period of the Renaissance.
There were also two groups at this point. Protestantism and Catholicism. On the Protestant side there were also various texts actually published, such as John Heydon’s Theomagia which taught divination, the creation of talismans, as well as expressing the existence of the pagan gods, and this was seen as perfectly fine, it even got printed in it’s entirety.
Then there are also texts such as the Kyranides, and Mysterium Sigillorum. As well as many more texts that speak on the creation of talismans and other kinds of magick.
And many apocryphal texts attributed to Aristotle, as well as of Ptolemy such as the Centiloquium attrubuted to him speak of Talismans, and this was highly regarded by just about every astrologer at the time. Even some of the works of the Church Fathers expressed the possibility of talismans and such.
Even scholars agree Agrippa was not widely persecuted for his De Occulta Philosophia, but rather Agrippa was theologian who argued for views that were against the Church. The definition of heresy.
Then there is also the islamic world, which seems to have been even more open about magick and the creation of talismans at the time, and many of these texts widely circulated in Europe at the time.
And this on magick, not even alchemy.
These things did not have to be hidden, nor were they. What was hidden in these texts, were secrets of philosophy, which the texts themselves expressedly state.
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That is very true. There may still be an unbroken chain of studen and mentor with Talismans or Geomancy in the Islamic World, I’m not sure, but seems it really did die more or less in Europe in the 1700s when Materialism became dominant. Or at least, it seriously transformed (for the worse, I think we can all agree, as we shift our perspectives to what those magicians knew at the start of their journey while we practice magick).
I do think understanding their philosophy and practicing magick is important for us as magicians. Depending on what each person wants at least.
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Okay forsure I appreciate it man. The way certain magicians described the great work was like without a specific formula or something you will not achieve the great work. If you are saying the great work is just the alchemical process to refine oneself then yes I have plenty of tools to do so, and I may have already achieved the great work in a previous life.
I see, why is stuff always subjective lmao!?
Yes there’s actually two verses referencing this actually
Luke 17:21
King James Bible
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you (or your midst).
Still in your midst and within you are very similar.
Also Psalms 82:6
…5They do not know or understand; they wander in the darkness; all the foundations of the earth are shaken. 6I have said, ‘You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High.’ 7But like mortals you will die, and like rulers you will fall.”…
John 10:34
Jesus replied, "Is it not written in your Law: ‘I have said you are gods’?
Ironically enough I just got kicked out a Christian Discord cuss I used the Psalms 82:6 verse and the minister said it was “out of context” but when Jesus references the Psalms he singles out 82:6 so by that logic Jesus took the word of God out of context lol. Also from my experience ministers and churches choose what verses to teach, rarely do you ever get the full context of what’s going on. And the minster that kicked me out would do the same thing, he would send daily verses but it wouldn’t be a wall of text it would just be a part of the entire section. But you, know whatever lmao.
I’ll check out that book, I bookmarked your message.
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Hmm yes I see what you mean, I take a blended approach as well, I read philosophy and I also practice magick. But I also do yoga. So I have a good mix. I have also worked with a wide range of entities, I’m currently in a angelic and Biblical phase. There’s an archetype of a young man rescuing his father from the belly of the whale or the depths of hell. Traditionally he is supposed to add on to and adjust it and improve it. But the religious zealots are essentially slaves to the indoctrination, some even go as far as to deny science and evolutionary theory…are there missing links buts what’s the alternative that the universe was created in a couple day? But then if you read the bible metaphorically or through the lends of psychology or symbolism people will say “NO NO JESUS LITERALLY TURNED WATER INTO WINE, HE LITTERALLY WALKED ON WATER”, that may very well be true but at the same time maybe those are also symbolic representations of alchemy and withstanding a storm of the uninitiated (water).
I thoroughly enjoy Jordan Peterson’s lectures on mythology and heroic stories and archetypes as a whole, he described the BIBLE FAR better than any pastor lmao
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Yeah there’s Christians and then there’s Christians. The separation and removal of spirit from being Christian started with pope constantine as far as i can tell.
Yhwh is “satan” and the old versions if the bible day so, and we’re rewritten to hide it and change the religion to give control to the church and preists… so thise preists get pissy if you follow yeshua’s ideas for self development, as it takes your power back from them.
Only yeshua the mystic tried to help people find ascension. The rest is garbage.
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Hmm that’s interesting, to my knowledge Satan is Samael.
From what I understand about YHWH is mercy, love, and wisdom.
But it’d be pretty ironic if my family gave me the name Elijah (which means YHWH is my God) and that’s actually Satan.
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You cannot be serious. Have you read about what he did in the bible(s) then. 
From murdering Moses, to sending a bear to maul children for poking fun at a so called prophet?
The dudes a vengeful, hateful psycopathic, warmongering, evil criminal who demanded people worship him and no other “gods” (elohim is a plural) was probably originally an actual person who demanded to be deified, not a god at all.
Worshiping him or in any way is a sin against the authentic inner god.
There’s a video in my Rambling thread with the evidence for this, from the bible, by comparing version edits.
Here’s the video for convenience, I’m sold myself, it would be easy to buy these versions of the bibles and check. I don’t agree with where he goes at the end of this video but as a pastor he knows his shit yhwh wise.
If you want to ascend, or be raptured as that’s the xtian version, yhwh is your poster boy of what not to do.
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Is this the part where I say hail Satan/YHWH?
I’ve heard this arguement before that YHWH is the demiurge or the actual Satan.
I’ve also heard Lucifer is the true God and that’s why he was trying to set people free from YHWH.
It’s all very interesting.
I’ll have to read more of the Bible as I do not remember these stories, or maybe the church never taught them.
I think the killing you are referring to is here:
Deuteronomy 34
New International Version
The Death of Moses
34 Then Moses climbed Mount Nebo(A) from the plains of Moab to the top of Pisgah,(B) across from Jericho.(C) There the Lord showed(D) him the whole land—from Gilead to Dan,(E) 2 all of Naphtali, the territory of Ephraim and Manasseh, all the land of Judah as far as the Mediterranean Sea,(F) 3 the Negev(G) and the whole region from the Valley of Jericho, the City of Palms,(H) as far as Zoar.(I) 4 Then the Lord said to him, “This is the land I promised on oath(J) to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob(K) when I said, ‘I will give it(L) to your descendants.’ I have let you see it with your eyes, but you will not cross(M) over into it.”
5 And Moses the servant of the Lord(N) died(O) there in Moab, as the Lord had said. 6 He buried him[a] in Moab, in the valley opposite Beth Peor,(P) but to this day no one knows where his grave is.(Q) 7 Moses was a hundred and twenty years old(R) when he died, yet his eyes were not weak(S) nor his strength gone.(T) 8 The Israelites grieved for Moses in the plains of Moab(U) thirty days,(V) until the time of weeping and mourning(W) was over.
9 Now Joshua son of Nun was filled with the spirit[b] of wisdom(X) because Moses had laid his hands on him.(Y) So the Israelites listened to him and did what the Lord had commanded Moses.
10 Since then, no prophet(Z) has risen in Israel like Moses,(AA) whom the Lord knew face to face,(AB) 11 who did all those signs and wonders(AC) the Lord sent him to do in Egypt—to Pharaoh and to all his officials(AD) and to his whole land. 12 For no one has(AE) ever shown the mighty power or performed the awesome deeds(AF) that Moses did in the sight of all Israel.
To me 120 years old seems like a good life but I didn’t understand why God prevented Moses from entering the promised land.
Here’s what I found:
Moses didn’t enter the Promised Land for the same reason many believers today are not living in God’s promises. | by Ed Elliott | Medium.
From my understanding Moses disobeyed God, he was angry and at the sin the Israelites did and he didn’t follow God’s orders to a T.
To me it seems like God is making an example out of Moses even if you are angry as a prophet of God you must obey God rather than try to manifest your own being or way of handling the situation, in this case striking the rock instead of speaking to it.
He does this throughout the Old testament a lot, the second people disobey his law (the foundational truth for existence) the Israelites and the state plunge into chaos and disorder.
I’m not saying you are wrong by any means… I’m just saying based on the context I’ve gathered it seems Moses is in the wrong as he didn’t do as he was instructed.
When I say YHWH is mercy, love, and wisdom I’m saying that in the context of you follow his laws, and you heed and obey his word. The second you deter from that and do your own thing or act in a sinful or wicked manner then yes YHWH/God will make your life a living hell.
I think this ties into the wrath or fury of God:
Romans 1:18 “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.”
Also as a man of YHWH you are supposed to fear God:
Proverbs 8:13
“The fear of the Lord is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.”
Maybe God is making an example out of his people and showing his wrath so that they know his power, and what not to do. So that they Fear his power above all else. You can call this tyrannical but this line of logic and reasoning is well manifested in my life.
If I got in trouble at school or I did something bad at the house and broke a law or rule of the house my parents would punish me, some times physically, sometimes psychologically, the point is in order for me to see them as an authority figure and to heed their word there had to be some component of having to deal with the consequences of my actions.
Parents try to instill morals and teach their children consequences in order to set them straight. Maybe that’s what God is doing here?
Ephesians 6:1 says, “Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right.”
I’ll be sure to watch that video when I have some time.
Oh, you mean like Zeus? According to his early mythology, he destroyed humanity 4 times and was going for a fifth, until Hera and Prometheus finally convinced him to stop, yet LHP folks have no problem working with him. He also was big time into rape, and torture, and was so insecure about his position as king that he threatened, bullied, and outright destroyed anyone who he thought might pose a threat. 
There are many pagan gods who have pulled the same BS everybody likes to throw onto Yahweh, but no one else gets the same level of hate. Historically, the Judaic stories were taken from the earlier myths of other deities so everything blamed on Yahweh, can easily be heaped onto the others as well.
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Are you referencing to the ancient sumerian and mesopotamian Gods?
Would you mind linking some resources to the Gods you see as the precursors?