What currents are you not willing to work with?

General Discussion
#1

I think it’s quite self explanatory, but just to clarify the question isn’t about what currents you do work with, but about which currents you are opposed to or less willing to working with. Examples that involve currents you aren’t morally opposed to, but that you are just not drawn to or perhaps are even scared of are also okay. (An explanation would be helpful).

For example I am opposed to working with anything that involves angels (this doesn’t include the Fallen), or a Monotheistic God. I also tend to steer away from LHP material based heavily on Christian lore (Qliphoth for example), not because I am opposed to it but because that’s not where I feel my Spiritual roots lie (I would be willing to work with the Qliphoth if I thought it would help accomplish my goals, but it just isn’t a path I feel drawn to).

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Godnames In OAA
#2

I won’t work with angels or a monotheistic god. Abrahamic related stuff doesn’t interest me at all.

I also won’t work with necromancy and Vodoun.

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#3

Interesting. Why?? Being a necromancer I would like to know what would turn someone away from this Path. Also could you explain why you won’t work with Vodoun?

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#4

Aside from making undead servitors, I fail to see any benefit in working with the spirits of the departed. All the information, and more, I need can be obtained through the ancient demons/gods I already work with. As well as other practices I perform.

Similar reason as to why I won’t do necromancy. Any sort of power or knowledge that I might desire can be obtained through the ancient demons/gods. Not to mention that I don’t want to offer myself to spirits I do not know well enough/trust. And, as you know, possession is a big thing in Vodoun.

People will disagree, thinking that I’m missing out on a huge thing. But, really, having read experiences of Vodoun practitioners, I fail to see something in that current which I can’t obtain from the currents I work with.

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#6

No need to apologize, I like to hear other perspectives and be proven wrong so that I may grow.

What you described sounds a lot like the spiritual alchemy which some ancient gods offer, only without the undead themes. The way I see it, it’s the same thing at its core, only colored in different colors depending on the tradition.

If I’m wrong, I’d like to hear what is so unique about the necormantic spiritual alchemy, then I would re-think my stance.

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#7

I beg to differ. I am not going to argue for Vodoun, because that is not a Path that I have worked with. I believe in experiencing new currents for the sake of experiencing new currents. The point for me isn’t immediate material results. It’s the growth of the Spirit and the power that comes from that.

Both will grow the Spirit, but with each transmutation the Spirit grows further, so I embrace both for the sake of Apotheosis. To climb to the top of as many Paths as possible in order to grow my Spirit. That is my goal.

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#8

Same here. But what I have noticed in my research, and conversations with magicians from many, many different currents…they’re essentially saying the same things, got the same results, they just use different terminologies and methods. Because, I fail to see the point of doing different methods for the same goal of the currents I work with already.

Of course, these magicians wouldn’t admit it, but when you take a step back…it really is the same thing, just colored in different colors, depending on the tradition.

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#9

@Baal It’s really about embracing what each current can give you. Any true path leads to Apotheosis, but each shapes the Spirit in it’s own unique way. Necromancy gives you undeath, the Qliphoth will burn you in it’s fires, Voudoun will teach you how to truly become one with the Spirits (it’s meant to be really good for possession right?) etc. Furthermore each feeds into one other. Learning another Path can help you with the one you currently walk. Each true current has something unique it can give you, and these gifts can be transferred across Paths to aid your development overall. Even if you sincerely have no interest in walking another Path to completion the lessons that can be taken from it and applied to your own Path may be worth it in and of itself.

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#10

That is true. I’ll decide what I’ll do. Right now, I’m pretty certain I won’t be exploring necromancy or Vodoun. Maybe in the future I’ll embark upon one or both of those paths.

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#11

There are different stages of posession.After you get to know spirits its beneficial.I’ve only had a handful of spirits fully possess me. The first stages are useful its like they are walking side by side with you advising improvements you can make to your life.Especially when its an ancestor that shared/s your blood.My ancestors practiced it so I study and practice it but its really a practice something you live and I really can’t explain it other than that. One of my purposes in this life is to heal family bonds on both sides of my family. A some of my power is hereditary so its both in my best interest and thinking about my children. And repaying kindness my ancestors have given me.

However, Vodoun i realized has prepared me for the LHP because there were a lot of decisions I had to make that I thought were moral. They turned out to not be so they were really just paranoia from vodoun practitioners that dont realize how christianity has influenced their religion.

But researching your family tree and your ancestors does have its benefits. Spirits your ancestors were kind to might start showing up.

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#12

Me, personally?

Well despite ceremonial magic being really cool to watch it’s not my thing, so paths dependent of ceremonial magic aren’t on my list. I also steer clear from stuff like Bible magic. My main problem with Christianity and Islam has more to do with teachings than world-veiw. That be said I don’t shun Judaism as much because there are teachings that make sense and it is the religion from which Kabbalah (and the idea of Qlipoth) originated. Kabbalah actually embraces the fact that evil is likely to be a trait of God, unlike in Christianity and Islam, who believe in an all-benevolent creator.

I’m also not really drawn to Hermetics or Thelema.

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#13

Necromancy has become more and more interesting to me, any recommendations for where to start?

As for what I will not work with, having been forcedly raised catholic, I oppose the idea of YHWH or Yeshua… Those are two beings I will never work with. I oppose the idea of monotheism entirely. No god before yourself, as I’ve begun favoring saying.

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#14

Perhaps the ideal magician would be confident and fluent with working with any current given the requirements of the particular stage of ascent that he/ she is on. I come from a western ceremonial magic background and so use the Tree of Life as a map / guide for ascent. Each spirituality has its place on the Tree. Witchcaft can easily be assigned to the lower spheres from Malkuth to Netzach. If the requirements of my process of ascent required me to work with Lucifer (who can be found in the sphere of Netzach) / the Devil and utilize witchcraft then I would (and have; being initiated into a family tradition of witchcraft (not Wicca)). I am also a fromer Jesuit so I have a more than ordinary experience with Catholicism / Christianity (which has its locus on the Tree of Life in the sphere of Tiphereth). If the requirements of ascent required me to return to that spirituality and re-enter Tiphereth, then I would (albeit I know that I would encounter the Christ spirit on a completely different level an context than I did as a young Jesuit; this time as an equal). If I needed to work with Odin in the Norse system (who corresponds to the Sphere of Hod) I would.

I suppose the ideal is to work with who / what you need to in order to get the result you need at the time with the overall goal of ascent in mind.

This requires immense spiritual and psychological flexibility; one has to reach the stage of a “meta spirituality” in order to fully utilize all spiritualities for the Great Work. This is what Chaos Magicians work towards. One needs to become a master of one’s own belief; adopting, bracketing and discarding belief systems at well. The really advanced magician will create belief systems where no belief systems exisited before if the available belief systems do not serve the purpose at hand; much the same as Newton needed to create Calculus in order to fully explicate his new system of Mechanics.

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#15

Perhaps it is precisely those currents that we are mose averse to that offer us the most opportunities for growth. This is where the Order of Nine Angles approach is actually quite wise. If one identifies as right hand path and is most comfortable within the Judeo-Christian current; perhaps he / she should fully immerse in Satanism for a time. Likewise, if one is comfortable working with Goetic demons; perhaps the best opportunity for further ascent would be to go and live the life of a Christian monk for a time. A Folkish white supremicist might benefit from going to Israel and spending time with an orthodox Jewish family. A Hare Krishna might benefit from becoming an apprentice butcher. And a convinced carnivore might benefit from a period of veganism. All of these inversions and heresies serve to loosen the hold of dogma on our minds and help us to become masters of ourselves by becoming masters of our own beliefs.

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#16

I’m kind of in the same boat with Baal. I have not interest in Necromancy though I don’t doubt that I’ll be going through some of it through the Qliphoth since that’s the path I’m following and one of them being the Lord of the Dead. It just doesn’t feel like it’s something for me.

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#17

Although this sounds nice and profound on first glance, one must first acknowledge what the opposition actually is before even considering diving into it.

It’s, in my opinion, pointless to dive into the opposing current just for the sake of “leaving your comfort zone” or whatever. If the opposing current is useless to you, don’t engage in it.

For example, I view the Judeo-Christian current as really weak. The Abrahamic current is about keeping your mouth shut, not growing in power as an INDIVIDUAL but remaining weak instead, not asking too many questions, and relying on holy scripture. You might say, well there are good values in the current! Yeah, but the thing is, Abrahamic cults have STOLEN so much, if not everything, from other cultures, inverted it, and slapped their own twisted atrocities of ideas onto them.

…So why don’t I just explore those cultures they’ve stolen from instead? Why don’t I explore the original sources, in lieu of their corruptions? Not to mention that angels are so much weaker than demons, and Yahweh is A LOT weaker than Bael, or Marduk.

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#18

Won’t work with anything Lovecraftian, nor anything I didn’t do proper research/divinations on…
I won’t work with anything that I feel that I am not ready to work with either.

I have worked with planetary spirits, mainly the Moon, Sun, and Mercury, but I don’t do much spiritwork so my experience is a bit limited.

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#19

Won’t work with any Lovecraftian old ones (except for Cthulhu). They fucked my life up. I might come back to it but probably not. One line I’m sure I won’t cross is working with the Abrahamic God and his loyal angels (Gabriel, Michael, etc.).

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#20

Same here.

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#21

Agreed - I used to think Necromancy was about calling up your relatives and hanging about graveyards and that’s it.

Santa Muerte can teach you a lot about all aspects of death.

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