What are loa?

Ive heard that Loa entities are demons and Ive also heard them referred to as the ‘loa Gods’. EA said they are some of the most powerful entities in existence. To put it into perspective… are angels like Metatron or Michael powerful enough to protect against them? How powerful are the Loa when compared to western grand demons like Azazel and Belial? I don’t know if my question is even relevant. I’m just thinking if someone sent Loa after a skilled western magician, would that magician be as well equipped to deal with the threat as another Hougan would?

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I don’t speak from experience having not worked with Loa, but I have always interpreted in my readings that they were there own sort of entity, similar to perhaps to buddhist gods.
As for protection I tend to find that the amount of protection provided has more to do with the depth of the relationship with the entity rather than its position on the ladder so to speak.
I’m unsure about how combat would go down, but I think, much like martial arts, its so so much in the style but the skill and experience of the user

Dante and EA have both said the loas power far surpasses that of even the strongest western demons and angels.

However, I do have some knowledge of at least two little known types of entities whose power rivals that of the loa. For various reasons I will not talk about those here though.

I know that Zoe was thinking of combating some sort of lesser loa which was protecting someone a client of hers wanted her to take on, she had an idea about how to combat it using western magic but due to various reasons backed out of the case, so we don’t know how that wouldve gone.

Do you have a reference for the quotes please
Thanks in advance

Horribly …

The question is not, I think, how powerful they are, but how powerful they are in this world for those who serve them. In Haiti, where Vodou is everywhere, I would guess a request to the Loa might ‘fail’ because Loa are probably walking with the other person too. Listening to EA it’s like an occult World War 3 over there and in West Africa. But in the West? Here in Europe? I doubt there’s anything to stop them. A magician I respect compared the two in this way:

The difference between the average Western Eclectic Occultist and the average Vodouisant of authentic lineage is that one is typically plugged into a thousand watt light fixture at best that may burn your bulb out when in the former mode. Vodou, however, plugs you into so much power you need instructions to use it so you don’t destroy your life in a nearly certain nuclear holocaust.

That’s pretty much it. The feeling when you’ve taken your first steps toward serving the Loa is that you have plugged yourself in to something which begins working immediately and with so much power that it will turn your life upside down and rearrange it - for the better … if you do things right. You will shake and sweat and your heart will race in awe and anticipation and due to the sheer physical connection with such power. And things will start appearing to you. This is not like the temporary doorway of evocation. This doesn’t let magic seep into the world for a while. I have the sneaking suspicion that when Legba opens the doors they stay open. It’s not just visions. Not just meaningful coincidences. These beings can appear to you out of nowhere in forms of flesh and blood. When you ask Papa Legba to open the way for you, be sure that it’s really what you want … and that you are prepared to be serving the Loa for the rest of your life.

In reverse, if a powerful Loa is protecting you, your own ‘abilities’ will be pretty much irrelevant, and your enemy won’t live - at the very least not as an able and sane person- to try his Western magic a second time.

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Do you have a reference for the quotes please
Thanks in advance[/quote]

EA said so on his facebook page when someone asked how Azazel stacks up in power to a loa, I believe he also said something similar in spider & the green butterfly. Dante told me so in person when we had a conversation about the loa.

What I`ve wondering lately is which ARE the most poweful entities?
Not some of the most, but THE MOST powerful??

Do you have a reference for the quotes please
Thanks in advance[/quote]

EA said so on his facebook page when someone asked how Azazel stacks up in power to a loa, I believe he also said something similar in spider & the green butterfly. Dante told me so in person when we had a conversation about the loa.[/quote]

I’m a bit confused about this. Does this mean that Azazel is less powerful than the spirits of the other traditions? If so, which spirits in the Western tradition would be comparable in power to those traditions?

Do you have a reference for the quotes please
Thanks in advance[/quote]

EA said so on his facebook page when someone asked how Azazel stacks up in power to a loa, I believe he also said something similar in spider & the green butterfly. Dante told me so in person when we had a conversation about the loa.[/quote]

I’m a bit confused about this. Does this mean that Azazel is less powerful than the spirits of the other traditions? If so, which spirits in the Western tradition would be comparable in power to those traditions?[/quote]

From what I understand there aren’t any in the western tradition that are comparable, though perhaps the Christian god might be, alot of energy gets put behind him but I’m no expert so that might not be the case.

I am viewing this topic in silence with nothing other to say than…Azazel chuckled about this very subject in the past when something happened in regard to this…and I would suggest that you call him up and ask him directly about this rather than taking other people’s statements…and let him tell you directly…for this you need to go directly to the source for your answer.

Maxx

The results of the prayers of Christians to their God say otherwise, and anything this thoughtform can do is so restricted by laws and morals that one ends up wondering just what it can actually do no matter how much power is behind it. I would say the Jesus egregore is far more powerful than this God in any case, judging by the immense power that can be wielded by a mere uttering of his name. I know from my own experience that this can end attacks by malevolent entities in an instant. I would never stoop to use it though, not least of all because doing so is going to bring whole lot of other problems into your life.

Demonic kings versus Loa? Or is it ‘traditional’ Western evocation versus traditional African service? Look at Quimbanda. They have a whole lot of spirits from the the Grimorium Verum in that path. How does Quimbanda stand up against the likes of Vodou? Is the problem with Paimon, Lucifer or Belial, or is it with the methods of Western magicians? I don’t know the answer to that … but in any case, what is there you could want that they couldn’t accomplish IF they agreed to your charges?

[quote=“Maxx, post:11, topic:520”]I am viewing this topic in silence with nothing other to say than…Azazel chuckled about this very subject in the past when something happened in regard to this…and I would suggest that you call him up and ask him directly about this rather than taking other people’s statements…and let him tell you directly…for this you need to go directly to the source for your answer.

Maxx[/quote]

I dont know Azazel but considering what you said and his reaction Im sure his 1000000% confident in his own power and abilities…regardless of the so called other deities…

I think perhaps this all depends on the structure of the Cosmos. On pp. 53 of the BOA, Azazel says that the Infernal Hierarchy is equivalent to the Operator and everything else in existence. What exactly does this mean? To Whom does Azazel answer? I don’t know at this time.

Yes aside from entities, the operator has the potential to achieve even greater power then a loa, by becoming your true self you’ll get to experience that power. My occult teacher is initiated in voudoun and I’ve seen his power so I sometimes wonder about why he decided to become subservient to the loa by working with them even though he himself can achieve greater power. His answer is its like being subservient to a car by giving it gas to drive. Still don’t know if voudoun is for me or not, but it gives you something to think about.

What Maxx said is interesting though, clearly Azazel knows something we don’t about all this. I might be seeing him tomarow so if he shows up I’ll have to ask him about what he found to be so funny there.

I certainly applaud your action…

Maxx

Delegation.
This is how I veiw my work with spirits, it is possible to get to a state where I can personally deal with things but its more consuming than evocation. Also the whole ritual process is so enjoyable, I know the words and the tools and the gestures seem silly to some but dramatics make it worth it for me.

Now this made me chuckle …

The Loa were once human. I’ll leave you to figure it out.

So the theory is that the dead graduate to divinity or, like Enoch, translate into divine beings?

No, not all the dead, it’s not a graduation, and as to what is ‘divine’ or not, it is a matter of human perspective. Their being dead is also … questionable. My own suspicion is that if the Loa were human, then they were humans who became ‘living gods’. I say their being dead is questionable because, firstly, it is questionable that a living god should have to die, and more pertinently, quite unlike other spirits I know of, they are able to manifest as real flesh and blood humans, with no incense smoke or theta-gamma sync or training to see spirits needed whatsoever. Papa Legba could appear on street corner in New York city collecting change in his hat and visible to thousands of ordinary humans who pass by. Of course that may just be a case of possession. They do that a lot. But I don’t presume to speak for them or the Vodou religion.