Is Astral sex the same as Physical sex

Fair enough. I have worked with over 30 entities now, and never had a bad experience. Your experience may differ. Perhaps call on Naamah, offer her a citrine stone that you will dedicate to her, be friendly and sincere, and you won’t go too far wrong.

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This can be said with pretty much every system of magick. If you have expectations of how the magick will manifest that will usually get shatter pretty quick even if the outcome is the desired one. :thinking:

Well, in angelic magic results don’t come in undesirable ways, undesirable and unexpected are not the same. And I don’t have problem working with dark entities, of tamasic nature. But dark entities who are quite low in the hierarchy is a big NO. They are the one which causes trouble. Problem is many demons can fall in the later category

:thinking: im curious as to who’s hierarchy are you refering to? :alien: if it’s for example the hierarchy in the literature like the goetia you need to be careful how much meaning you attach to that. Field of speciality and rank are not the same also to be remembered that most if not all the entities that are refered to as demons in most literature were gods of other cultures that were demonize by those that sought to conquer and convert. Be it religions or rival tribes.

The advantages of working through the lense of the demonic though is most ofnthe imposed human limits are stripped in the demonizing.

For example the div/demon sovar leader of the divs in the Zoroastrian lore is shiva demonized. But i can tell you from experience the energies of the 2 is quite different as all human attachment to the force is strip in one and whats left to work with is a very primal force of leadership to work with.

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That’s the thing. It is not easy to know the hierarchy of beings, when asked by E. A azazel gave a bullshit politically correct answer. ( I think you know what it is). And also just because two entities represent the same archtype doesn’t mean they have same energy. ( As ur experience with zorostrian god and Hindu god revealed to you). Like there is Agni, vedic god of fire and there is Agni Bhairav, Bhairavas are dark, tamasic entities who embodies all negative qualities and are worshipped only through occult means. Also popularity of any diety amongst the mass isn’t a good indicator too, I am pretty sure about it.

If your speaking of this :point_down:
dodel

Not sure how it’s a “politically correct answer” since from the standpoint of the magical operation the operator takes up the position of “first cause” to create change whether they are working with planets,elements, angels, demons, fire giants, frost giants, aisir, fanir, asura, deava, Egyptian god, naga, the dead, animal spirits ect.

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Yeah, I wouldn’t call it “politically correct”, but it is a bit of an exasperating answer in that it evades the intent of the question: as in, besides the Operator, what does the hierarchy of spirits look like?

Damn spirits, always giving vague/ambiguous/exasperating answers to questions when all you really want is specifics! :joy:

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Not all humans are like that, but I know that from experience. I myself am not, and my homies are not- but we are rare, this I know. To each their own whatever sex they rule out, stick to, or try, but I had to tell you, there ARE humans who are about real shit and want to be in relationships with real mutual love.

When you consider the various pantheons and cultrues the idea that there would be DA ONE TRUE ANZWER OF HIERARCHY that effects all gods,spirits ect seems to comes back to a lingering attachment to societal monotheistic subconscious program to me at least.

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Right, I mean within whatever cultural or magickal paradigm you’re using. Obviously different pantheons and systems are going to have competing notions over who rules what.

Exactly this is why the statement that the hierarchy begins with the operator is one of the most practical. For example in my work with the path of smoke you have ahriman aka the black sun and the divs who are the rays of this sun.

But these forces are within self which is why they are not invoked or evoked in the manner that spirits in other systems are. The practitioner becomes the balancing force of the polarities. In this case arhiman and the divs being darkness and the practitioner being the light that guides that power. Thus eliminating the “need” for an external god as the practitioner becomes creator and destroyer. :alien:

That’s related to the magickal technique Kurtis Joseph calls envocation, right? It’d be interesting to try this with other spirits outside of the Ahrimanian paradigm. :thinking:

Getting back to the hierarchy question though, pragmatically speaking I agree it’s best to start with the axiom that the hierarchy begins with the operator: that way you’re not subjecting yourself to an external force that you’ve set up higher than yourself in your ontology/cosmogony. But beyond that, it’s still (at least for me) an interesting question to determine what the relative power rankings are between spirits within a specific paradigm.

Take the Goetic demons, for instance. We have a rudimentary ranking in place as defined by medieval texts like the Ars Goetia and the Pseudomonarchia Daemonum: Kings, Dukes, Princes, Marquises, Counts, Knights, and Presidents. Much more power and authority is attributed to a King compared to a Knight, but the trouble is that the various texts assign the rankings differently. Overall, though, there still appears to be a scale by which we can rank the entities in question, with respective spirits having fewer or greater legions of subordinate demons under their command relative to their power.

Even in The Black Magick of Ahriman, Joseph writes (for example) about Sovar that “as the Div of evil speech he is considered the commander and leader of all Divs.” So Sovar would be further up in the power hierarchy than other Divs, and presumably Ahriman at the top. Unless it’s more appropriate to say that Ahriman is the name for the general force/current of the paradigm and therefore not easily comparable to isolated intelligences like the Divs?

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This is the one of the later operations yes but that has a few alchemical prerequisites that need to be preformed first for the safety of the operator. The other 2 are kunda yoga and a specific method of evocation that works as a method of extraction. Kunda yoga awakening the ray desired to be worked with and evocation in this case creating a mirror which this force can be communed with.

Considering it from this angle may answer some questions, ahriman being the the black sun and the divs being the emenations or rays of this sun these rays connect and intermingle like smoke. From my experiences so for this is no clear cut “one above another” system when it comes to ahriman and the divs. They are expressions of potential as such one has more power and wisdom in a certain area than another would.

An example of this would be taprev who is able to teach methods of root cunning and how to create plant familars compared to zarman who controls the processes of aging or Astwihad the bond divider force and mysteries of death. Each has something they can teach.

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That was my initial impression as well, but what then do you make of his assessment of Sovar as the commander and leader of all other Divs seemingly regardless of area? I understand every Div (and for that matter, every goetic spirit) has a different focus and expertise, but it still seems possible, at least in a loose way, to compare their power or ability to effect change in reality across the different areas. :japanese_ogre:

Thought-provoking discussion, even if we landed a little off-topic! :grin:

Lol here is some food for thought. In the lore From the aspect of self, Ahriman is considered both the greatest fears of self and the greatests potential. Sovar is the force of command. While aeshema wields the powers of all divs as an example of the power one has when all the separate aspects of consciousness are reunited.

Then you have Az-jahi the devouring force of the night who rules over death and the druj.

And last zohak who was known as the first kunda or man turned devil through intergrating and wielding these powers as his own.

There is ALOT to consider and more to explore. Kurits was not joking when he said in one of his videos that this current can supply enough work for a lifetime. :alien:

So I heard that in the Astral Realm, manifestation occurs at a MUCH faster rate than in the physical world, and if that’s the case, can I have Astral Sex with my Waifu (such as from a video game) if I concentrate on her enough?

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Man u are funny for that. :joy::joy::joy::joy:

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How do you exactly have astral sex?

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Astral sex is 10x more pleasurable and orgasmic and less tiring than with a human based on my own experience. The easiest way to have it is to do it with a spirit lover/incubus/succubus. You will also feel high. It will open all of your chakras and cleanse you energies. It can even heal you.

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To have astral sex with a spirit, you need to focus on the spirit. They will flirt with you anyway. Fantasize with the spirit knowing that spirits can read our minds, they will see if you want to have sex with them.

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