How Our Educational Programs Work

Yes, in several years, most likely.

Aha, thanks. Guess I better get some money magick rolling again then.

“But sadly, many ignorant fools steal intellectual property from content creators, like E.A… For the economically illiterate: if you steal products, the seller earns less revenue.”

How does that make sense?

The total number of books that are available by EA to purchase through you guys right now is: 0. All of EA’s works are out of production, so instead of shelling out a few hundred dollars (or a months worth of food for some people), you get it for free off the Internet. You lose nothing since you’re not selling anything. I don’t see the entire corpus of EA being offered in paperback by your printing house, I see the Complete Works being sold for $400. What if I don’t want all the works and I only want Works of Darkness? Should I still have spent $400 on a blind buy?

All the EA works I could get for a relatively reasonable price were had: Book of Azazel and Questing After Visions.

Answer to question #3: yes.

No, you don’t “get it for free off the internet”.

You steal it off the internet, and thus, get it for free.

You lose nothing since you're not selling anything. I don't see the entire corpus of EA being offered in paperback by your printing house, I see the Complete Works being sold for $400. What if I don't want all the works and I only want Works of Darkness? Should I still have spent $400 on a blind buy?

Pirating intellectual property generally reduces the demand for the product, and causes a direct, measurable loss in revenue. (Research the film and music industry to learn how piracy is destroying them)

There is, of course, the very rare case that a product “goes viral”, and the content creator experiences a massive, temporary spike in demand and revenue. But that is akin to winning the lottery.

I’m very thankful for the success of the Complete Works, and if I could, I’d personally shake the hand of everyone who acquired a copy, because I cherish their support.

That being said, I know for a fact there was a percentage of people who had already pirated digital replicas of the material, and as a result decided not to get a physical copy. This meant less income from the sale, and now less resources to invest into the growth of this project.

I myself am pro-technology, and embrace the hacker/piracy culture. But if we’re going to debate the principle morality of pirating intellectual property, I am going to point out the errors in thinking.

hey timothi
you talked about the future programs that will come up every 3-5 months
amm i dont like beeing nudgy but from divination to the release of evokation its 9.5 months, well i dont mind but in the future the programs will be released quicker? thnx

"No, you don’t “get it for free off the internet”.

You steal it off the internet, and thus, get it for free."

You say that like it’s a bad thing. I thought, since you being an LHP magician, you would have no such thinking.

“I myself am pro-technology, and embrace the hacker/piracy culture. But if we’re going to debate the principle morality of pirating intellectual property, I am going to point out the errors in thinking.”

So you embrace the piracy culture but when it affects you, that’s where you draw the line?

“But if we’re going to debate the principle morality of pirating intellectual property, I am going to point out the errors in thinking.”

The only thing that really sticks out would be the word ‘morality’… Which is coming from a self-professed LHP magician. That makes no sense.

Anyway, we weren’t debating over the principle of morality, I was pointing out that since there are no available methods for acquiring EA’s material without using pirating, you won’t see any profits. Do you expect people to wait for the books to available again especially since EA has said time and time again that he won’t be republishing his old works?

Come on.

You say that like it's a bad thing. I thought, since you being an LHP magician, you would have no such thinking.

Being a black magician does not mean you advocate stealing, or violating property rights.

I don’t know how you arrived at that asinine conclusion.

If anything, a sorcerer demands the most secure property rights, so that he can safely manage his possessions, without others taxing or stealing from him.

(This is why the most intense sorcerers are also inevitably anti-government)

So you embrace the piracy culture but when it affects you, that's where you draw the line?

No. As I’ve stated multiple times now, I am against theft, because it punishes the people you support.

That being said, I acknowledge the prevalence of the hacker and pirating culture, and recognize the futility of fighting against it.

I am hardcore pro-technology, and believe digital thievery is a natural outgrowth of that. So in that sense, it serves as a good indicator that the digital world is thriving, which I like. (But I’m still against theft)

The only thing that really sticks out would be the word 'morality'... Which is coming from a self-professed LHP magician. That makes no sense.

Again, you raise this childish notion that left hand path sorcerers lack ethics. This is patently false.

A black magician derives morality from efficacy and utility.

Therefore, however he needs to live in order to increase personal power, he is thus duty-bound to abide.

To me, the surest path to becoming rich and powerful is to be a capitalist, that is to say, support free trade, property rights, and productive investments.

Hence, my moral opposition to stealing.

Anyway, we weren't debating over the principle of morality,

Yes, we were. You just didn’t realize it. All arguments and debates go back down into ethical principles and utilitarian measurements.

I was pointing out that since there are no available methods for acquiring EA's material without using pirating, you won't see any profits. Do you expect people to wait for the books to available again especially since EA has said time and time again that he won't be republishing his old works?

And this is my second time now directing your attention to the principle of the argument. (Perhaps you need to Google what the fuck that means)

It is irrelevant if we should expect people to wait for E.A.'s books. What matters is that it’s WRONG for them to steal his books in the first place.

And for the record, we are considering as a possibility re-releasing his books as eBooks, and piracy will, without a doubt, decrease the revenue we bring in from that sale. This, in turn, slows down the growth of Become A Living God.


And for anyone else reading this… E.A. and I have discussed at length the notion of internet piracy. While we do not advocate it, and in fact are against theft in general, we do realize it’s inevitable, and we don’t necessarily begrudge you for doing it.

At the risk of sounding stingy or cheap, I engaged in this anti-piracy debate, simply because it was brought up over and over again, and I want to lay it to rest.

If you’re going to pirate our shit, then fucking do it. But don’t expect us to be thrilled about it. It’s a back-handed compliment at best.

1 Like

I did not say that black magicians lack ethics or advocate anything. I was very vague in my statement.

Moral: “of or relating to principles of right and wrong in behavior” (Merriam Webster Dictionary). That is not something that exists for a black magician. There is no right or wrong, since there is no duality.

Aren’t most debates matters of ‘morals’? It seems so to my mind, now that you bring it up.

It is NOT WRONG to steal his books, especially since they are treasure troves of knowledge that will propel a Neophyte into Adepthood! They should be available for everyone!

I have the PDFs and I’m glad I have them. I need them. I’m working through them. And if you were to make available the PDFs from BALG, I would buy every last one of them just to support the movement. But maybe I’m the only one who actually cares about this movement. Or you could ask everyone else who loves this movement.

Anyway, I really enjoyed your insight, Timothy. Hope to see some new posts from you.

Yes, it does. Morality dictates behavior.

A black magician acts in whatever way brings the most power.

That is his ethical code.

It is NOT WRONG to steal his books, especially since they are treasure troves of knowledge that will propel a Neophyte into Adepthood! They should be available for everyone!

It is wrong to steal, no matter how you try to rationalize it.

But maybe I'm the only one who actually cares about this movement.

And now you’ve gone full retard. Discussion over.

“And now you’ve gone full retard. Discussion over.”

You’re fucking kidding right? You can’t read into the context of my sentence and see that it was a sarcastic stab at your idea that people who already have the PDFs won’t buy the authorized ones from BALG? You must be honestly fucking kidding.

You're fucking kidding right? You can't read into the context of my sentence and see that it was a sarcastic stab at your idea that people who already have the PDFs won't buy the authorized ones from BALG? You must be honestly fucking kidding.

No. What I see is you doing 3 things:

  1. Claiming black magicians have no ethics (wrong)

  2. Advocating stealing (wrong)

  3. Questioning if you are the only one who loves BALG (wrong)

To me, that is full retard.

hahahahahaha

  1. I didn’t say that, I said there is no established code of ethics that applies for all black magicians.

  2. That’s a matter of perception in all honesty. I advocate the access of spiritual knowledge for free to the masses, or the destruction of the Occult. Not paying hundreds of dollars for limited editions that’ll never be around again. And yes I realize that you have the programs and I will probably partake of those.

  3. Sarcastic stab, I didn’t say flat out: “Am I the only one who cares about BALG?” Because, if you didn’t notice or just didn’t read, I also added: “Or you could ask everyone else who loves this movement.” Which would imply that I, yes, even I, the retarded person on this forum, don’t believe that I’m the only one who loves BALG.

To me, in my personal view, you didn’t read my posts at all.

1. I didn't say that, I said there is no established code of ethics that applies for all black magicians.
Yes, you did. Here's your direct quote:

There is a fundamental ethical code for black magicians. I have said it in this post, and also this one:

http://becomealivinggod.com/forum/black-magick-the-left-hand-path/the-psychology-of-black-magick/

The ultimate, defining code of conduct for left hand path sorcery is this:

Increase your personal power.

This is the principle by which you dictate whether your behavior is good or bad. This is called a “moral”.

3. Sarcastic stab, I didn't say flat out: "Am I the only one who cares about BALG?" Because, if you didn't notice or just didn't read, I also added: "Or you could ask everyone else who loves this movement." Which would imply that I, yes, even I, the retarded person on this forum, don't believe that I'm the only one who loves BALG.
Fine.
To me, in my personal view, you didn't read my posts at all.
I not only read them, I ripped them apart, exposing their flaws.

And to the contrary, it’s clear that you’re the one who hasn’t truly read and internalized my posts.

Don’t try to convince me that piracy is morally acceptable, and then expect me not to defend against it.

Morals are subjective, for the most part I think, if anything would be considered a objective moral I think its moral to follow your dharma, if that means you need to pirate or try to stop people from pirating then thats the moral thing for you to do.

Morals are subjective, for the most part I think, if anything would be considered a objective moral I think its moral to follow your dharma, if that means you need to pirate or try to stop people from pirating then thats the moral thing for you to do.

Morals are subjective on an individual basis.

But the left hand path, which is a practical philosophy, has a defining ethic, which is self-aggrandizement.

I dont think black magicians are supposed to be assholes.

All I can say is that I took the time to save and purchase some of EAs books on eBay and then went and also got the complete works after. I was willing to spend the money for good material. I used to pirate stuff too, until I saw how destructive it was becoming to several industries (the creators in particular). If musicians, authors, etc can take the time to put stuff out that I enjoy then they deserve my support by purchase of their product. It’s how they make a living after all.

I think two things, and could be incorrect on point 1 given the full thread:

  1. An aspiring mage obtains select works, whether used or not in full for not only enjoyment of reading but putting them into practice, with intent on getting the real deal when they are able, and do because that thought was as good as word, a binding intent to one day own the book that was once an eBook. Once the book is purchased, the eBook which was never shared with anyone else, not even quotes from it, is deleted once and for all.

  2. An aspiring mage works the magick they know how to use, and obtains the money to buy the real deal in full, no eBook used.

Now, this also means that the BALG eBook was bought in full by PayPal or a credit card of some sort. Also note the “eBook” for any other work than BALG, is an electronic book of any type, usually a PDF file.

I understand that it is frowned upon to own an eBook in any way that was not purchased. However, I am the type of person that occasionally searches on google or wherever else for books that I intend to use, and I am the tech type that has mainly PDF files on occasion. I don’t share with anyone, perhaps I’m greedy like that.

However, if it is that big a deal, delete all eBooks that you are not supposed to have, and go with option 2. Which is what I am going to do with anything questionable. All apologies given. I’m also a person of my word, what I had come across in PDF form will be bought for real when the money is there. In the meantime, anything questionable will be promptly deleted.

I guess I never realized or thought that it may have been out there in electronic form without some sort of issue with that. With every type of music site or other sites with stuff out there for preview or download, I thought the whole debate on this was pretty much a non-issue now. My thought was that technology moves so fast now, that people just put there works out there and get paid for it in some other way like advertiing on the same site.

My view was that if a book is not meant to be out there, it will not be out there. That view may be flawed, but that is my view. An example is that if you have a sensitive server and connect it to the internet, or any other comm line and it is not physically secured, then it is no longer a secure server. Whether or not the shareholders wanted it to be connected or not.

There are several sites not torrents (mind you, I dont use those), that have them (books) up as if they were there as if they were a public library. Case in point: project gutenberg.

Now this raises a question, what is the ethic involved if an Adept Mage no longer needs certain reference books and donates them to a public library, that the books wil most likely be dust collectors, until a dabbler that is meant to be a mage comes across it?

Is it then unethical or illegal in terms of piracy/privacy?

Again, no harm meant for coming across some of the works in electronic form, and no works of yours are in my possession without it being bought.

James Del Fuego