Danger of demons, then why summon them?

Spirits, Evocation & Possession
21

If NAP works, I don’t see why you actually need to work with demons. I mean, folks will say that the powers of the “dark” are “necessary”, but to be honest… it’s very personal. I mean I’ll continue to say it, but the more you worry about what is “correct”, the more you are going to have problems. You felt sick with Paimon, and when you banished him, you got better. Sounds like you did the right thing, and personally dealing with things of this nature I can say there is nothing noble or “strong” about taking an unnecessary ass beating.

Magick is supposed to be the most natural birthright to humans, but for whatever reason, folks seem to enjoy making it dramatic. It doesn’t have to be, and I personally didn’t get anywhere until I threw that drama to the wayside. Blinking is a natural ability, and yet you don’t see anyone making a big deal about it, even though you eyes would dry into dust without it.

If it isn’t your cup of tea, don’t drink it. In magic, you are the master of the power, and no one spirit is gonna get you to a place any quicker or slower than you a really ready for or want to go. So don’t fret too much about it, and I’d personally recommend that you don’t get too involved in the idea of this great “hero/warrior’s journey” that seems to pervade occultism. If you want to, then that is perfectly up to you, but it’s not even close to the mindset I feel works with accepting a power as natural. You’re not going to miss anything by not summoning Paimon if you don’t feel like it, nor do you have to go through the “purging flames” to achieve ascension. These are just experiences that particular people need for their own personal evolution, so just try to find what works for you.

1 Like
22

[quote=“swordy, post:7, topic:2073”]So basically E.A’s beings are like playing with fire.

I hope E.A produces a list of safer spirits one day, or maybe he already has them and should share with us.[/quote]

EA had produced a list of “safer spirits” in Evoking Eternity: Angels and Elementals.

23

Demons aren’t Dangerous O_o
Humankind vision of freedom and religion is!
What puts people in danger whenever there is a Demon around is their belief in something that is not real, is their faith on something that is not truly worthy.
If someone suddenly went public saying that here on this forum there are only Wackos and this is a forum of depravity and unholiness wouldn’t it make most of you feel anger and rage ? If you could wouldn’t you do something about it ? Some of you probably would choose a good way of dealing with it because you’d be able to contain your anger and you probably would try to make the person that went public regret what it was said and try to make that person take his or her words back ( once again in public ), but probably some other portion of you would simply just harm her for what she said. That is what happens, there is the danger, the lack of trust humans have in themselves to start with and then the lack of Everything humans have towards Demons themselves. Making them sometimes really really Angry and probably Endangering some really nice persons who probably didn’t deserve it…

1 Like
24

In the end everything is a tool for you to either use or not. Demon, Angels, Elements, and even other people are all tools for one’s ascent ( Hell even I have been called a tool) What you want to work with is up to you. While I believe that working with every type of entity (Demon, Angel, Elemental, and Planetary are the four distinctions I use) one could reach Godhood by a different avenue.

Try it, play around, and have fun is my motto.

By the way, what is NAP?

25

New Avatar Power by Geoff Gray Cobb

26

I’m into Uncle Bearheart stuff, do you know him ?

So you confirm reptilian do exist ? I’m studying the topic and admit that I dont know what to think about this.[/quote]

Yeah their real my freind got tossed across the room by it

27

I have a wife and two small boys, at the beginning of the evocation I tell the demon they are off hand. I don’t ask I command it. Never had any problems knock on wood. And with things being dangerous well fast cars are but I like to hall ass. Nailing girls without a condom as a youth was dangerous but I’ve blasted in a few lol. Lots of things have risks you will just have to see if its worth the reward. However don’t think angels are playing a harp chilling on a cloud… They can rip your fucking face off in an instant, I really see no difference from them and demons for the most part.

28

Good point, anything in life is risky and there is no guarantee of safety. Also, Magic is infinitely powerful and helps create our kingdom.

Also another point E.A. mentioned is “God for one civilization becomes a demon for another civilization.”

But I do wish, if we could at least categories the entities in the risk to profit/gain ratio, it would be very helpful for beginners.

Especially for the starters/beginners who get possessed by starting out with a a very powerful entity that they are not equipped to handle at this moment.

Although E.A. mentions that possession does not happen with our approval, well I would contradict and say, when we look at the advertisement for a product we don’t buy that product with out our own approval. But you see in advertisements we are actually manipulated to trying them out. This is what happens with people being possessed who do not consciously want to get possessed.

At the moment the information regarding the entities are very foggy. I would when I have more time, combine the experiences of the members of this forum and the other forums like evocationmagic,and create a database. At least I would if I could hire someone to create the database.

29

Good point. I would welcome such a database. At the moment I have to look all over the internet to check if someone mentions if the entity is good natured or not. Such information would stimulate beginners to make the jump to start evoking a lot sooner.

30 
  -something that might help is developing your ability to "scan-sense" so you can get a reading without it being either On or Off only- ie ability to Connect with a lesser connection.. then lessser, from starting out with the door all the way Open.

For ex like only being able to get a sense of someone the moment they and you both sit down at the same tbl- already in Contact (or you've opened your door- to your home- and "invited them in")... but be able to see them further away, then "further" (sort of like getting a vibe, but over time (a bit a day, a few inquiry-sensings in and months-to a yr that blds alot- so you can tap the Current, glance at the sigil, read the Name in context as Feel their Field... "taste" that field- does it seems compatible, sympatico or "iffy"?

So above seems qualified as my preconception is the first thought is- how do that all at once, but developing- like how get a read on a neighborhood, or a particular “location” more from less (as sometimes ‘more is less’) not as the full decision, but gather info- like utilizing long-range radar, and spotters, as you approach updating to prepare, compare/contrasting…

at times the sense of a field-current tapped by a Name, its like there can be a couple of hallways that branch, and how you tune-in can go slightly different than the other, and end up with quite a different encounter (ie the saying “dont go there”… Not 1sizefitsAll in terms of this Name isn’t safe, and this Name is always… each “opens doors” -to reference Lemarchand’s Config

but in terms of a listing of how what- it just reminded me of a useful, to me, method in Chinese Energy Work-systems where 4 categories- “large-margin of error” =‘safer’, vs ‘small-margin of error’ (Need to be on- lower tolerance, but more responsive, so see results… higher-tolerance means not as reactive so slower…), and type of results/ Potential “high” or “lower”…
So:

  1. Large-margin of error, lower potential- the intro “try it out”…

  2. Large-margin of error, Higher Potential (can tinker and if off it won’t burn you just fizzle, but if you get it right, it wins big- so you can play with to “trial and error” or at least, self-study vs needing constant guidance)

  3. Small-margin of error, Higher Potential (these are the types where in a short period of time Huge Gains can be made, or like plugging one’s system into a HighVoltage charge- if wired right, boom, if not, Short-out, burn, pain… dmg… so many say “if you are feeling burned out, take a break” -if that works, you’re not doing this category, as some can tinker with a tech and fry their systems, leave it along and yrs later still the same or worsen… even the first try, but that shows the power
    (like a car that you tap the accelerator and the car leaps, vs one you press down the gas and the car starts to move- like a tank or a ship in water… the later, in a ship, if you slip the steering wheel or turn it quick right and then quick straighten it, likely it just washes out and not change course… try that in a racing-motorcycle)
    These are the kind of exers, they say you could be taught and doing correctly but if you go home and continue practicing you could adjust your tech just slightly and over time…! or your system can reveal some change, which changes everything- thus the “requirement” of being under “guidance” so the teacher can quickly scan daily, or at least weekly, to catch before veers off course… ( contrast this with the “experiment” mad-scientist method of take this concept and that and mix together… could Work, as long as not Use this category… (big dejavu as I wrote this part)

In a system where, to say 5 different “initiations” each making major changes-upgrading, they could be each separate, so seq not impacting… but in others the seq (abc-def, being different than acb-def… and can’t ever go back and change) -but if do this, boom get results or not, then this boom (be qualified by preparation, etc.) that’s a system- but like how the parts in a high-speed, max-performance system needs to have all aligned perfectly, any wobble could cause it to rip apart… vs a design, not quite the “efficiency” (and if pushing the very edges of possible- only that perfect synergy can hit escapeV), but “clunks” and keeps going (and if figure, I’ll try and see how it feels…)

(lastly category 4- watch for this kind)

so more than dangerous or not- at least 3 kinds (safe to muddle in, risky but at most like acrobatics you can pull/tear something and have to spend time healing, taking a break. vs 3rd- like acrobatics where high-speed aloft, not worry about popping something, worry about landing on your head
(ie is it an Operation, or Entity, where each word, each moment of your Nonverbal responses could trigger a response- from the Operation Energies being in-line or not- like being robbed at gunpt by a wired-out adrenalized frenzy, flinch wrong or one moment of eye-contact could set them off. Or less “violent” but an interview (person or Entity) where a moment of disrespect or even disinterest and no-big deal all friends, but you lose your chance forever- no second oppor… vs able to try again. <compare to it “seems” dangerous to have a Migrane, and a few days of badluck- a nighthag/edrain… sort of like the magical muscle-tear or NervousSystem fry… that recovers, vs “need medical intervention to fix” (so many say Initation or Kunda-type Epractices if off a bit, rest a bit and adjust, vs need have an expert go in and rewire the burned-out parts… as can happen).

I don’t know -working model- might add to this, in terms of the questions, good thoughts

31

[quote=“taokua, post:30, topic:2073”] -something that might help is developing your ability to “scan-sense” so you can get a reading without it being either On or Off only- ie ability to Connect with a lesser connection… then lessser, from starting out with the door all the way Open.

For ex like only being able to get a sense of someone the moment they and you both sit down at the same tbl- already in Contact (or you've opened your door- to your home- and "invited them in")... but be able to see them further away, then "further" (sort of like getting a vibe, but over time (a bit a day, a few inquiry-sensings in and months-to a yr that blds alot- so you can tap the Current, glance at the sigil, read the Name in context as Feel their Field... "taste" that field- does it seems compatible, sympatico or "iffy"?

So above seems qualified as my preconception is the first thought is- how do that all at once, but developing- like how get a read on a neighborhood, or a particular “location” more from less (as sometimes ‘more is less’) not as the full decision, but gather info- like utilizing long-range radar, and spotters, as you approach updating to prepare, compare/contrasting…

at times the sense of a field-current tapped by a Name, its like there can be a couple of hallways that branch, and how you tune-in can go slightly different than the other, and end up with quite a different encounter (ie the saying “dont go there”… Not 1sizefitsAll in terms of this Name isn’t safe, and this Name is always… each “opens doors” -to reference Lemarchand’s Config

but in terms of a listing of how what- it just reminded me of a useful, to me, method in Chinese Energy Work-systems where 4 categories- “large-margin of error” =‘safer’, vs ‘small-margin of error’ (Need to be on- lower tolerance, but more responsive, so see results… higher-tolerance means not as reactive so slower…), and type of results/ Potential “high” or “lower”…
So:

  1. Large-margin of error, lower potential- the intro “try it out”…

  2. Large-margin of error, Higher Potential (can tinker and if off it won’t burn you just fizzle, but if you get it right, it wins big- so you can play with to “trial and error” or at least, self-study vs needing constant guidance)

  3. Small-margin of error, Higher Potential (these are the types where in a short period of time Huge Gains can be made, or like plugging one’s system into a HighVoltage charge- if wired right, boom, if not, Short-out, burn, pain… dmg… so many say “if you are feeling burned out, take a break” -if that works, you’re not doing this category, as some can tinker with a tech and fry their systems, leave it along and yrs later still the same or worsen… even the first try, but that shows the power
    (like a car that you tap the accelerator and the car leaps, vs one you press down the gas and the car starts to move- like a tank or a ship in water… the later, in a ship, if you slip the steering wheel or turn it quick right and then quick straighten it, likely it just washes out and not change course… try that in a racing-motorcycle)
    These are the kind of exers, they say you could be taught and doing correctly but if you go home and continue practicing you could adjust your tech just slightly and over time…! or your system can reveal some change, which changes everything- thus the “requirement” of being under “guidance” so the teacher can quickly scan daily, or at least weekly, to catch before veers off course… ( contrast this with the “experiment” mad-scientist method of take this concept and that and mix together… could Work, as long as not Use this category… (big dejavu as I wrote this part)

In a system where, to say 5 different “initiations” each making major changes-upgrading, they could be each separate, so seq not impacting… but in others the seq (abc-def, being different than acb-def… and can’t ever go back and change) -but if do this, boom get results or not, then this boom (be qualified by preparation, etc.) that’s a system- but like how the parts in a high-speed, max-performance system needs to have all aligned perfectly, any wobble could cause it to rip apart… vs a design, not quite the “efficiency” (and if pushing the very edges of possible- only that perfect synergy can hit escapeV), but “clunks” and keeps going (and if figure, I’ll try and see how it feels…)

(lastly category 4- watch for this kind)

so more than dangerous or not- at least 3 kinds (safe to muddle in, risky but at most like acrobatics you can pull/tear something and have to spend time healing, taking a break. vs 3rd- like acrobatics where high-speed aloft, not worry about popping something, worry about landing on your head
(ie is it an Operation, or Entity, where each word, each moment of your Nonverbal responses could trigger a response- from the Operation Energies being in-line or not- like being robbed at gunpt by a wired-out adrenalized frenzy, flinch wrong or one moment of eye-contact could set them off. Or less “violent” but an interview (person or Entity) where a moment of disrespect or even disinterest and no-big deal all friends, but you lose your chance forever- no second oppor… vs able to try again. <compare to it “seems” dangerous to have a Migrane, and a few days of badluck- a nighthag/edrain… sort of like the magical muscle-tear or NervousSystem fry… that recovers, vs “need medical intervention to fix” (so many say Initation or Kunda-type Epractices if off a bit, rest a bit and adjust, vs need have an expert go in and rewire the burned-out parts… as can happen).

I don’t know -working model- might add to this, in terms of the questions, good thoughts[/quote]

TaoKua you seem knowledgeable, although there is lot of crappy information on YouTube about demonic invocation, some are very legit like the below one:

Like this one: [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEfWVkq4JOk]Former Witch speaks of his powers to do evil using Astral Projection, Spells, and Curses - YouTube

This guy on the video has got no agenda, only advise.

Evocation is playing with fire and there is a serious danger.

After I started practicing the inverted diagram from evocation, I wake up at night as if something is controlling by body and I wake up in that moment paralyzed etc.

Like the guy in the video says you might not able to sleep or the entities wake you up.

I have experienced them. I am not catholic and I am not brought up in any particular religious ideals and I am Sane.

When you play with fire at least the beginners should aim for the beneficial spirits.

Go for the most beneficial angels or demons that are well researched and benevolent.

In a Necromancy video from becomealivinggod YouTube, E.A. and another magician do warn us like this magician got his spine wrecked etc.

So GUYS DO RESEARCH EXTREMELY GOOD AND NOTE THEM IN A DIARY and have some good protection, respect, Confidence, a very clear head and strong determination when playing with dangerous demons or angels.

On a side note: I worked with Sastan as recommended by E.A. for clairvoyance and Sastan helped me get into theta gamma sync and I experienced visions.

E.A.'s stuff is very powerful, I feel lots of improvement from using his techniques. Thanks a lot, E.A.

32

[quote=“taokua, post:30, topic:2073”] -something that might help is developing your ability to “scan-sense” so you can get a reading without it being either On or Off only- ie ability to Connect with a lesser connection… then lessser, from starting out with the door all the way Open.

For ex like only being able to get a sense of someone the moment they and you both sit down at the same tbl- already in Contact (or you've opened your door- to your home- and "invited them in")... but be able to see them further away, then "further" (sort of like getting a vibe, but over time (a bit a day, a few inquiry-sensings in and months-to a yr that blds alot- so you can tap the Current, glance at the sigil, read the Name in context as Feel their Field... "taste" that field- does it seems compatible, sympatico or "iffy"?

So above seems qualified as my preconception is the first thought is- how do that all at once, but developing- like how get a read on a neighborhood, or a particular “location” more from less (as sometimes ‘more is less’) not as the full decision, but gather info- like utilizing long-range radar, and spotters, as you approach updating to prepare, compare/contrasting…

at times the sense of a field-current tapped by a Name, its like there can be a couple of hallways that branch, and how you tune-in can go slightly different than the other, and end up with quite a different encounter (ie the saying “dont go there”… Not 1sizefitsAll in terms of this Name isn’t safe, and this Name is always… each “opens doors” -to reference Lemarchand’s Config

but in terms of a listing of how what- it just reminded me of a useful, to me, method in Chinese Energy Work-systems where 4 categories- “large-margin of error” =‘safer’, vs ‘small-margin of error’ (Need to be on- lower tolerance, but more responsive, so see results… higher-tolerance means not as reactive so slower…), and type of results/ Potential “high” or “lower”…
So:

  1. Large-margin of error, lower potential- the intro “try it out”…

  2. Large-margin of error, Higher Potential (can tinker and if off it won’t burn you just fizzle, but if you get it right, it wins big- so you can play with to “trial and error” or at least, self-study vs needing constant guidance)

  3. Small-margin of error, Higher Potential (these are the types where in a short period of time Huge Gains can be made, or like plugging one’s system into a HighVoltage charge- if wired right, boom, if not, Short-out, burn, pain… dmg… so many say “if you are feeling burned out, take a break” -if that works, you’re not doing this category, as some can tinker with a tech and fry their systems, leave it along and yrs later still the same or worsen… even the first try, but that shows the power
    (like a car that you tap the accelerator and the car leaps, vs one you press down the gas and the car starts to move- like a tank or a ship in water… the later, in a ship, if you slip the steering wheel or turn it quick right and then quick straighten it, likely it just washes out and not change course… try that in a racing-motorcycle)
    These are the kind of exers, they say you could be taught and doing correctly but if you go home and continue practicing you could adjust your tech just slightly and over time…! or your system can reveal some change, which changes everything- thus the “requirement” of being under “guidance” so the teacher can quickly scan daily, or at least weekly, to catch before veers off course… ( contrast this with the “experiment” mad-scientist method of take this concept and that and mix together… could Work, as long as not Use this category… (big dejavu as I wrote this part)

In a system where, to say 5 different “initiations” each making major changes-upgrading, they could be each separate, so seq not impacting… but in others the seq (abc-def, being different than acb-def… and can’t ever go back and change) -but if do this, boom get results or not, then this boom (be qualified by preparation, etc.) that’s a system- but like how the parts in a high-speed, max-performance system needs to have all aligned perfectly, any wobble could cause it to rip apart… vs a design, not quite the “efficiency” (and if pushing the very edges of possible- only that perfect synergy can hit escapeV), but “clunks” and keeps going (and if figure, I’ll try and see how it feels…)

(lastly category 4- watch for this kind)

so more than dangerous or not- at least 3 kinds (safe to muddle in, risky but at most like acrobatics you can pull/tear something and have to spend time healing, taking a break. vs 3rd- like acrobatics where high-speed aloft, not worry about popping something, worry about landing on your head
(ie is it an Operation, or Entity, where each word, each moment of your Nonverbal responses could trigger a response- from the Operation Energies being in-line or not- like being robbed at gunpt by a wired-out adrenalized frenzy, flinch wrong or one moment of eye-contact could set them off. Or less “violent” but an interview (person or Entity) where a moment of disrespect or even disinterest and no-big deal all friends, but you lose your chance forever- no second oppor… vs able to try again. <compare to it “seems” dangerous to have a Migrane, and a few days of badluck- a nighthag/edrain… sort of like the magical muscle-tear or NervousSystem fry… that recovers, vs “need medical intervention to fix” (so many say Initation or Kunda-type Epractices if off a bit, rest a bit and adjust, vs need have an expert go in and rewire the burned-out parts… as can happen).

I don’t know -working model- might add to this, in terms of the questions, good thoughts[/quote]

Thanks Tao for the Good advice.

Some Burnouts can be extremely bad and it could just worsen with time as we plugin a very high dangerous voltage especially the demonic energy.

I reread your post many times (I did for few others as well). I get many insights as I reread them over and over again.

This is a wonderful way of categorizing risk to gain.

Cheers

33

I found other very good reasons to evoke demons as well in my research!

like this thread below:

Evocations: Why Work WIth Infernals?

http://www.molochsorcery.com/infernals.html

34

Demon is not a useful word for me any more. Nor is infernal as it’s used here now that I think of it. Dantalian is a spirit predominantly of the element of air and anything but some fiery beast from a burning hell. On the other hand, the distinction between more benevolent and malevolent, and even more so various distinctions of type nearer to or farther away from humanity and its corner of the cosmos, are useful, and believe me there are some fucked up chimeras out there in the cold, dark reaches of the cosmos and in the blackest recesses of the mind which you do not want to be dealing with if you wish to retain your humantiy and sanity and freedom. Further still, anyone who writes off dualism and the struggle between good and evil as some Abrahamic fable has confused ancient metaphysical wisdom with the moralistic distortion thereof. The anti-God is a necessary reality, and it will seriously fuck your up if you walk its path to Nothingness. Just ask the Illuminati.

35

You got interesting points, benevolent and malevolent is a better way to categorize than good and evil(in a moral stand point only).

You also got another important view “there are some fucked up chimeras out there in the cold, dark reaches of the cosmos and in the blackest recesses of the mind which you do not want to be dealing with if you wish to retain your humantiy and sanity and freedom.”

Thanks man, for the contribution and it makes complete sense.

36

[quote=“Orismen, post:2, topic:2073”]The higher the risk the higher the reward.

My life was challenged in ways that I never considered while working with Belial. Things in my life were destroyed and (with Belial’s guidance) picked up the pieces and made something better.

That is the key to remember I think. As bad as it gets you can make it better. Of course exercise common sence. Belail showed me the very real possibility of my marriage ending, and I had to fight a demonic king to keep my marriage. Now if Belial would have told me to lock my wife in the house and burn it to the ground I would have shown Belial the door. So working with powerful entities of any persuasion can lead to “harmful” things happening in your life. But the best safe guard is to keep a good head on your shoulders and if it gets too much for you end your workings and banish.

Hope this helps.[/quote]

It took me sometime and reading your reply many times to understand your point, Orismen.

That is a brave thing to do :slight_smile: “My life was challenged in ways that I never considered while working with Belial. Things in my life were destroyed and (with Belial’s guidance) picked up the pieces and made something better.” So like an alchemy.

And you could not persuade Belial and so you had to fight with Belial to save your marriage!

I too experienced the same thing many times with powerful ones, they control you with emotions. So your advice is a very good safeguard. “But the best safe guard is to keep a good head on your shoulders and if it gets too much for you end your workings and banish.”

37

So the old has to be broken to make way for the new!

38

[quote=“Kokuto, post:6, topic:2073”]The danger as previous posters have brought up, arises primarily from the fallibility of the operator. As each person has to develop themselves, this fallibility will be reduced and eventually vanish altogether. Since it is known that if you can summon a being, you should be able to manage it, the logic goes that if you end up screwing it up the problem likely lies somewhere internally.

Plus, besides ‘power don’t come cheap’, its implied a lot of the times. You need to have a life shaped to use and handle power.[/quote]

Your advice is a rare gem, thanks man.

39

[quote=“Vergil, post:22, topic:2073”][quote=“swordy, post:7, topic:2073”]So basically E.A’s beings are like playing with fire.

I hope E.A produces a list of safer spirits one day, or maybe he already has them and should share with us.[/quote]

EA had produced a list of “safer spirits” in Evoking Eternity: Angels and Elementals.[/quote]

Thanks Vergil. Looking up on it. :slight_smile:

40

That Curtis Kelley dude in the YT video had me cracking up, when he implied that the boogie man was real. I recalled a comedy skit, with a spooky looking character, “Hello, I’m the boogie man, straight from your closet!” My little brother used to see monsters in the disused fireplace in our bedroom and wouldn’t sleep, or would wake up crying about it, the poor little thing. I just can’t see why a spirit would want to hang out under a bed, or in a cupboard, or wherever. Why confine themselves?
Yes, I have certainly had spirits keeping me awake at night. If I am able to identity who they are, I can usually say something like, "What exactly is it that you want, because I would sure like some sleep!"
I totally agree with the analogy of the loaded gun. Anything powerful, that you don’t know how to use can harm you, or others. I also think some spirits might give you a scare, or something similar, just to test you, to make sure you know who you’re dealing with.