Are they worth it? Read if the answer is yes

This is actually a nice outline. I’ve considered layering spells before.

My only question would be , don’t you need a fetish link for a love spell/curse to work on a target ?

What if all I have is a name and can’t find a photo , don’t have a article of clothing , strand of hair or even a birthday ?

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Nope…BUT, what you do after you establish contact is your business. Myself, after I’ve established contact, I state my request in the present tense and then pull up a good strong visualization and feeling of the result and me enjoying it.

If you’ve ever read Damon Brand’s Seduction Magick, he suggests to do this and I’ve stayed w/ it. Winterfeld says it too.

It’s of major importance to do this while your in the presence of the spirit and making the request. They need to see and feel the result to know exactly what you’re after.

IF, you wanted to incorporate a fetish item, lock of hair, pic, etc…this is probably when I would lay it on the demon’s sigil. If it’s a pic- I’d lay it face down.


I’d bookmarked this and have been mulling it over for awhile, I think I’m ready to get going.
Started with the divination today. I know the target is feeling something, so I did a three card spread on what a likely outcome will be if I proceed. I got: Queen of Pentacles (r), three of Swords, three of Pentacles (r). So um, not great. I’m reading it as I’m getting into this for selfish reasons, it will bring a lot of heartache and in the end, we won’t be able to work this out together. I’m laughing it’s so bad :laughing:
But, the heart wants etc. I’m starting off with a petition to Lerajae to break ‘em up (yup, this is a difficult target situation) and then going from there. I really like the using other friends as influence aspect, so will definitely be thinking on that next step.
Anyhow, thanks for lots of great info and will update!
Anyone else have any thoughts/results?


Don’t skimp on the Belial/ Vine combo. The relationship is a major obstacle that will need to be cleared in one way or another. If you inserted Leraje in AFTER those two, the relationship would already be a house of cards, if not over already.


Started with this at the beginning of the week. Called Viné first, to remove all resistance and blockages he has against being with me, and to any of my influence (Magickal or otherwise). I really like that spirit, not the first time evoking him and always that pleasant and strong energy, like a very wise gentleman.

Next day I called Belial, to make me be perceived as supremely high status marriage material, not only by him but by 3 people more the target has a good relationship with. At some point I heard “we don’t worry about ants” :sweat_smile:

Things were great in my friendship with my target and during the last few days they started going downhill, with him not giving me much time and definitely not making me anything close to a priority, so yesterday we had a not that friendly conversation and I’m afraid I came up as… maybe a bit dependent on him? Of course I rephrased things so that I didn’t look like it, but I’m not sure he bought it. I think the needy energy was there. No good. Our whole power dynamic has changed a lot in the last few months, with him having the upper hand the whole time, something that is definitely bad for me and my objectives.

And now I kind of feel like… is it possible that Belial doesn’t want to give me an aspect of being high status, but want for me to really be it? What I mean is, after this, I realized I’ve put myself in a position where my target holds all the power, and maybe Belial wants to really give me all the power, dignity and status that I’ve asked for, instead of giving me only the appearance of it. And the way to go is to show me how my behaviour hurts me and to force me to focus on myself, as I’ve decided now. And yes, I still want to make him think X of me with Dantalion, and to work with Gremori… but that will be of no good if I’m just waiting at home for his calls. I feel I needed to reach to the point of saying “fuck it”, I’m first working in the real world and with spirits to go back to the self I lost at the beginning of the year, where I have plenty of people crazy about me, I have my own life and I don’t need you. I may let you be part of my great life, but you’re not the center of it. And maybe even when I finish working on myself I won’t even care about what you do or think about me, because you’re not that amazing.

Don’t know if that’s how Belial works or if I’m just trying to make sense of a blow back of my shitty dependent attitude, but I feel enough is enough. Thanks @56cpdb for suggesting working with Belial, your advice is always on point. It might not have worked out as I wished, and now I’m a bit down… but I want to be here to be the operator of my own amazing reality, and not just a crying I-want-my-ex-back baby :joy:



I sent you a PM…

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Good idea.


Hello, can you please help me out i cant sent peivate texts to you

You joined 1 day ago , you dont have that feature unlocked

No i dont, so i have been praying on pomba gira maria padilha to bring back my exb i was wondering if i should ask more spirits or demons to help me out? As he looks like has a negrative energy around him or a shield. Thank you


Layer Spell you will get alot of threads you can research them that can help

So can i ask Vine and Belial now even i already started with Pomba Gira Maria Padilha and as well to Dantalion?

Would this work better?

I know very little about Pomba Gira Maria Padilha other than that she might be an incarnation of Satan.

This spell is complicated because it addresses a complicated situation from multiple angles. It’s alot more than just Vine and Belial.

Personally, I’d follow the advice of Vikson, and, depending on how long ago you contacted Pomba Gira, the contact you made, etc…I’d search this sight for information on lusting for results.

9 times out of 10, love rituals are undermined by “lusting for results.” I try and avoid spirit-hopping as much as possible.

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Can you do a similar layered combo but with Lucifer and the Hidden Demons book?

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Regarding Vine, where it’s said he has that power?
And regarding Gamori and eye contact, what if i do not manage to see her often? Any other solution?

Why not?

You should try it and find out, and it’s a good idea to do a divination as the OP suggested.

You might be the first person to do so, and who knows if what works for others will work for you? Sounds like a cool design to me though and I would expect it should.

Right here in this thread. :smiley:

As you get into designing your own workings, you will find you rely on your own experience on what various entities will, or will not, work with you on much more than other people’s stuff.

Don’t just assume because it’s in a book it’s gospel or that because it’s in a forum thread it must be suspect either, there’s good ideas everywhere, but i the end it’s only you doing the actual work: you MAKE it work, or you don’t. :smiley:

Just imagine it: fake it till you make it. Also work on your senses. Your magick will get better all around from that. There’s no substitute for developing your energy and senses, no.

As was posted:


You also might have to consider that’s a sign Gremori just doesn’t want to work with you right now, that happens… a divination should clear up if it’s a skill issue or an energy mismatch like that.



Vine tears down walls- the old grimoires talk about his ability to tear down stone walls that protect castles. That power can be interpreted psychologically as well.

Trust me. Vine is a master at destroying a target’s defenses and leaving them vulnerable to other forms of magick in the same way that castles are left vulnerable when the walls that protect them crumble.

You have to think deeply and contemplate these powers in order to get a sense of what these demons offer.

Mulberry nailed it. Try it and see.

I have found Gremori to be amazing at the eye contact thing! But if you can’t manage the eye contact- you might need another approach.

FYI you can absolutely use LHD for a layered love spell. I’m pretty sure I’ve posted one somewhere.

Also, if you can’t make eye contact, try Anamalon from LHD and use your voice. The power is “To arouse sexual thoughts in others when you speak.” Just substitute that pathworking in place of the request to Gremori.


Unfortunately i’m not that good yet in regards of results. I’ve had a casual success by making the wrong request to Maggid of LHD.
I also tried Magick of Angels and Demons by Henry Archer but that book never worked for me.
I asked it because in those books Belial and Vine got assigned with different powers then what stated in old grimoires.
I had a brief eye contact with the target some days ago but i didn’t use any evocation for her as a target.
I don’t know if i’ll ever meet her again. It was a casual encounter. I’m not very social and i don’t go often in pubs ecc so i leaved the plsce earlier without approaching her.
I do think she interested in me though, not to the point of obsession nor love. But i perceive she may be shy just as myself.
We follow each other on social network.
She live near my home.

Can Belial be used to break down limiting self perceptions?

Yes. Check out the gateway symbols:

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