Against Mother Nature

Hey so I have a friend tryna talk me down from going down the path of black Magick saying things like invocations, rituals etc are just a cheat code and that I am going against nature.

Personally I feel it is actually more natural to go down this path and learn this way but just wanted peoples opinion.


water finds the easiest way through and its the most natural life given force most people know of

however its not a easy cheat way…


They fail to understand nature, actually. Moreover how destiny works.


Its very hard to answer for this question.
Some people would Say its True others that is not. You have to decide on your own what is better for you and corresponds with your conscience


That’s correct, so stop having showers and using soap. Don’t iron your clothing either. Don’t go on candle-lit dinner dates or send flowers…

The lhp is against the natural. It goes against the flow. The antinomian Order of Nine Angles have stated that in a National Socialist society they would be communist.



@Jusgolden If I may share a detailed thought?

First of all, great thread topic.

Second, here’s were the detailed thought comes into play. Its seems as though your friend Tryna is an important person in your life and that if they weren’t, this question and thus resulting outreach for insight would not have risen.

I would suggest to try and think in many shapes, i.e. try to look at it in Tryna’s perspective. You know your friend and what moves them, this may help bring certain points of understanding; tying connections.

Third, I would also suggest to look into aspects of nature known to you and research others unknown to you. For example, how do you define nature and that which makes some actions and thoughts ‘unnatural’? How do you see the ‘natural’ flow in life; i.e. your own personal experiences, instinct, shared experiences and how they’ve effected you, in all aspects of your life.

After you feel that you have a well rounded knowledge base, maybe comparing your perspective and Tryna’s perspective could provide an answer or a more expanded question. Still serving it’s purpose, expanding your mind.

Nature and the human existence is subjective. There are certain things that no human can dispute, like gravity; what comes up must go down. Death, all things living, end. Nature at it’s core is not conscious of what it does, so we humans believe. It just exists, starts, survives, procreates and thus ends; beginning a new cycle.

At the end of the day, your life is your’s. Your journey is unique to you. Though you may share some instances with others and it may influence you; remember to stay within instinct and logic to help guide you in all endeavors.


That was a good laugh!!!

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Magick is the oldest and most primal intellectual activity of mankind, imagining the wanted outcome and then coming to think that helped make it happen is probably the origin of abstract thought.

Cave paintings showed things that people wanted to happen, most of the time, that seems to have been the origin of sympathetic magick, which later developed into using poppets, talismans and amulets, etc.

Animals do this, as well, a dog will go and sit where his walkies leash is, and any move you make in that direction will be greeted with excitement because he’s imagining the walk starting. :man_shrugging:

Magick is the most natural thing in the universe, because All is Mind.

Why do I say that? This short, free, book will explain it all: The Kybalion PDF, archived link (we don’t trade PDFs on here as a general rule but this one is okay, the text is out of copyright and the edition was given for download from the site that created it).


So true! Instantly, self help books and life coaching popped into mind! Like those guys on late night tv trying to self you common sense and a series of books to go with it lmao


Ignore ya friend and pursue the path. Your Power will prove itself in time


Let’s follow that train of thought for a moment, if invocations, rituals etc are cheat codes, then that would mean they are built into the system of nature, so there for are to be used.

So is your friend implying it’s better to be just an NPC’s running here and there…For who and what exactly?




Magical practices are summoning the forces of nature. Incarnated, as witches, shamans, healers, and sorcerers, in talismans, potions and enchantments, magic is one of those most mysterious forces of NATURE and our relationship with the divine. Some argue not only for the existence of magic as part of nature, but that we’re all capable of practicing it, even unconsciously. Nature with enhancing or destroying life, is in its own way a form of magic. Regardless of our belief in it, it’s one of humanity’s oldest practices and, for that alone, the recognition of magic is nothing short of indispensable as part of nature and life itself.


They can call them cheat codes but to actually practice an art requires dedication, commitment which I wouldn’t consider cheating. Especially when sometimes this art can cheat you. With magick, you don’t look into it, it’ll look into you and it’s up to you whether to allow that or not.


Thank you guys so much for the feedback sorry been busy the past few days depression is a bitch


Nah bro Magick is hard af lol.
The work definitely pays off tho⚡️


You saying like it’s way to complex for someone to be turning it down without evening having a grasp on basic topics yet?

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Personally, as humans, we go beyond nature. We aren’t constrained by instincts, passively reacting to various stimuli like animals do. Your friend makes it sound that Magick is really not only against nature but against the natural order. You should do some discerning if you want to be a person on the sidelines or in the game, someone who passively exists or strives to exert their will onto the world. One thing that held me back was the idea that I shouldn’t do anything because I would disrupt the destinies of others. When one thinks like that, the only person who loses is yourself. So if magick is the conduit you seek to develop yourself, then do it. Just be careful what you ask and will for :wink:

What then, is the nature of man?
Are we not natural ourselves, our desires and designs following from nature?

Are we by defenition super-natural?
If so, then why should we seek nature in our ways?
Contemplate that question well enough, and some would say you’ve already done magic.

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Yeah at the very least your friend should do some research before speaking on something he knows nothing about.
But with the “against nature” argument, if you think about it our very existence itself is not completely natural because we have evolved to be intelligent beings with a free will (beyond our primal instincts), living in complex social structures. Sounds pretty magickal to me lol

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