I am asking this OutsidE of the Judeao Christian religion. Thanks!
Depends on definition of an Angel Lucifer is the good what we r taught dogmatic religions is wrong define fallen?
IDK. Personally? I do not have a reason to use fallen yet, its just a word I see used on this forum. Then again, it could lead to an endless argument over semantics. That is why I asked the question.
Yes but in order for me to answer my point of view i need the definition or your understanding of fallen personally Lucifer is in Astral strong how is he fallen Lucifer is risen? Something to reflect upon that’s my view
Well, as an ex Christian who is trying to make sense of all of this, I would guess that a fallen angel is neither a devil, nor an angel that remained completely true to its purpose… So I would assume that it is an angel that no longer feels compelled to serve the heirarchy that it once found itself in.
bingo. think of it as a neutral or grey entity. its not entirely demonic but not entirely angelic. a “demonic angel” of sorts.
Hmm. Well it sounds kinda like me. I am definitely not naturally dark, nor do I feel compelled to “serve” in order to help people.
It sounds pretty interesting.
Do their presence (or energy) during/after evocation influence the surrounding enviroment?
I would agree with @Nagathex at some point. Lucifer is known as spirit that achieved perfect balance between 2 types of energies (light and dark) and he is known as Demonic Angel but to be more accurate he is one of many gods of “this universe”.
I was studying stories and symbolical meanings from some religions and I found answer for myself which again don’t have to be true but I decided to share it here.
Term such as “Fallen angels” actually can be referred to his childrens on earth. Having literal and symbolical meaning at the same time. Some people are indeed here on earth with non-human soul with specific purposes. Be it “just” for self-improvement but mostly with very specific purposes to improve this world. So technically, term “fallen” can not be referred to Lucifer directly in literal meaning as some books said it, or at least people have to look deeper and understand real meaning behind those terms such as that one.
Basically, they are beings (be it angelic, demonic, or celestial nature or any other… depending on a spirit and aspect that created them) that come (“fell”) on this earth as something opposite than humans but still same, because we all share same trails at some point (we are all spirits, we are all based of energy).
Ohh, and also. From a point of view of LHP it could also be referred to all of us. As spirits that turn against religions (their dogma) and started seeking for godlike powers.
That was shown from very many different Entity’s to me to be a specific of the teachings currently given to Mankind, aswell as us.
The General understanding of Guilt being a falsehood,
and rather seeking a deeper understanding of what it serves, who it serves, and how that benefit’s Self / Others, - seemed to be a big part of what Leviathan wanted me to look through and empethise.
Most recently i watched German Neuro-Scientist’s actually discussing on the Matter and how actual Changes in the Human System of How we can use the Relaxed, multi-perspective Mind more and more natrual, by being less Hard-Driver by Stress, and potential benefit’s of that to our General species, seemed to be a Topic obviously evolved out of Spiritual Workings i participated in.
As well as for example Stephen Hawkings funding and Pushing Science in towards more Astral Reseurch and actually turning part’s of the recent “Science-Fiction” into actual project’s of colonizing new Planets and seeking the Intergalactic travel.
To my understanding These Things are Held as opposite by the scientists, while actually depending on each other.
As for example a Travel on a Ship may lead to a complete seperate human culture after a few Generations, then a similar ship saddeling down for a Planet to colonize.
While at the same time, the main Planet Needs to be strengthened instead of destroyed,
actually providing a Base from which the Species can opperate, rather then a Black Dot of Failed history, where there is no way of turning back at all.
In the End, a final Stable Society is required in each of These different sectors, while at the same time they’ll eventually find themselfes to be open organisms, re-attaching to the orgininal or new Connections, and also working with unknown species aswell as re-turning home in smaller parts.
Again, a Civilization which is basing all of their Needs, on a Greed may work for a certain period of time. But both Bible and History clearly Show shortcommings that deprive from that, and that Need to be resolved, for a fully working Transformed World / or Society.
This, however even takes Objectives in consideration that my initial Spiritual Guidance refused.
The whole idea of colonizing the Astral Sphere’s fully active is in non-Alignement with my original inner Guidance.
Working with the Society, Cults and especially certain Teachers and Mentors, revealed how strong there is a Hunting and also a Seeking desire, deeply embeded.
Which also made clear, that both part’s Need a shared ability to grow.
However, it’s very interesting, to look at These Terms that got into Play there aswell.
As they seem to contradict a big part of the other side.
This will indeed lead to interesting Changes as well as Manifestations.
And it may actually prevent a good part of Reaping,
at least in the “War” Frame of Reap.
And as i love Numinosis,
a quick Glimps in the variousity the Term “fallen” gets, by simply pushing it onto Persian and back to English:
Relatively modest, humble, simple, temperate, fallen
Low, low, low, low, low, fallen
Post, Rude, Don, Fantasy, Fallen, Minor
Weak, diminishing, falling, fallen
Unassuming, unpretentious, simple, fallen, uncontrollable
there we have, both humble and Rude, even diminishing as direct Lingual Connections.
Considering that Angel generally means being of Light / Fire, and fallen for example is deprived here as “relativly modest / low temperature” you could also see it as Chilled Fire. Cold Burn. (one of the explenations i allways loved!)
Personally, I feel an angel is ‘fallen’ when it goes against the angelic order that it is a part of. All angelic spirits have a hierarchy that they are parts of, and to fall is to go against that hierarchy or the moral code that it follows.
Nothing. Categorization made by a personal belief system, traditions and rhetorics.