So in the Goetia there will be Kings followed by Dukes and Princes etc, I was wondering if the people that follow a king in the book are part of that kings kingdom and are under him, until the next king shows up? I was wondering if that is how the Goetia works and is written?
I’m not sure I fully understand the question, sorry - I’ll try to explain why:
what do you mean by “people that follow a King in the book” - do you mean human people, or beings living in that demon’s realm?
what do you mean by “until the next King shows up”? Do you mean the links to astrological houses throughout the cycle of the year, or something else?
Hope you don’t mind the questions, I’m just not clear what they address.
Tto my current level of understanding, your initiating djinni (called Scirlin in Grimoire Verum) brings you to the 4 Elemental Kings (Magot, Egym, Paimon/Bayemon, and Amaymon), who give you permission to contact the 7 Planetary Spirits.
The main Planetary Spirit is Lucifer, who as 2 Planetary subrulers (Frimost and Astarot). These 2 subrulers form Subtrinities (Frimost with Silcharde and Guland; Astarot, Bechard, and Surgat).
Under each of these 7 Planetary Spirits you have the Djinni of Ars Goetia, given in 7 spirit ranks.
Each of the djinni in Ars Goetia has their many attending servitors.
I laid out the hierarchy as far as i can understand it here.
In the Western Magickal goetia tradition, this hiearchy is rarely hinted at and barely followed, but in ATR traditions such as Quimbanda, it is rigorously adhered to in different ways and with different orders than the one i gave.
This spirit hierarchy is internally consistent as far as its astrological correspondence is given.Background reading in related grimoires such as the Grimoire of Pope Honorius and Grimoire Verum, the spirit hierarchies hinted at in Ars Goetia are made apparent. You begin to understand there is an esablished order to these things that is taken for granted by grammar writers, even though it’s not given explicitly in any one source.
I mean the spirits that follow in the book, so for example Beleth is number 13 in the book and Sallos is number 19, so is Sallos under Beleth? Then number 20 is Purson, so would that mean Bune is under Purson?
hmmm is what I am asking still unclear? I would imagine somebody knows.
I mean you would think the answer is yes, but can anyone say for sure?
Hmmmm it seems as though the forum isn’t answering my questions as much as it used to, is it me? Am I asking too difficult questions or is there some Magick retreat everyone is off at… or?
Anyways I just tried asking Beleth, I didn’t do a full evocation or anything but was just like: yo does it work this way? and I heard back: “No but sort of”
“What does that mean, I don’t get it.”
“It’s more incestuous than that.”
"I’m still not sure I follow so does that mean it is not broken down into kingdoms in the way the
Goetia puts them into order?
“Well it does.”
“I thought you said it was incestuous?”
“Well okay I do rule over say Sallos but I would also rule over Dantalion, But Belial would also rule over Sallos and Dantalion, but if you want to get technical Sallos is part of my Kingdom and Dantalion is part of Belial’s, it is techically useful, I guess, but it usually doesn’t come up as such per say.”
So does anyone else have a gnosis on this topic or did I just make a discovery?
Did you read @emperor 's post? He gives a very detailed hierarchy in that thread.