Issue with Meditation Leading To Astral Journeys

I really wish we had a separate board here for meditation discussions because it’s a huge subject and not all meditations are done with the intention to progress into astral travel.

Anyway, I have seen threads for how to stay awake during theta/gamma and rapture states or while meditating but I need some tips on this for astral journeys. My problem is that, I have been delving deeper into astral travel but I am calling them astral journeys instead because the purpose of my travels is to undergo personal journeys similar to the ones the shamans partake of when they get insanely high and go on a visual journey. I am not using drugs though, I start off with meditation, open my chakras, surround myself with protective flames and light and begin to clear my mind until I reach an absolute black empty mind with no racing thoughts or unwanted visuals that can interfere with me.

The method I am currently using I prefer to keep private because it’s one of those successes you wish to remain as yours and yours alone however, my method is working a little too well. With normal meditation going into theta to do sigil magick and whatnot it takes me about 15 minutes to clear my mind and even then, unwanted thoughts still seep thru on occasion. The method I use to undergo complete rapture and soul travel has my mind cleared within 5-7 minutes but shortly after the visuals come and I begin to move around my body is so comfortable where it lies and my astral body gets tuckered out so quickly as if my movement is literally taking place from within my actual body that I fall asleep and black out.

I usually and wake up back in my body about 30 mins. to an hour or so later as if suddenly snapped back into my body with a vengeance, enough to wake me right up. It’s annoying because this happens usually when I am in another realm and speaking to a spirit. How rude is that? Being thrown from the astral plane and back into my body because my physical body fell asleep on me and it’s like when that happens my experiences do not continue as dreams or anything they just come to a complete hault. It’s only the astral travel or deep deep states of trance that cause this to happen, regular meditation and normal theta states do not.

Not sure if I explained this in a non-confusing way but when it happens I don’t get to finish what I was in the middle of or if I did then I am unaware of it because I come back to my body with partially blank memories only remembering the first few minutes of my journey. The following day At some point I experience an intense visual, an epiphany of sorts where some of the information comes flooding back to me that was lost the night before but a big part of me feels uneasy about this because I feel like during the vision I get the next day, that most likely not everything that I accidentally blocked out from the journey the night before was shown to me in that vision. I always feel like there are pieces that I am still missing, probably something important that I needed to remember but cannot.

How can I keep my body from falling asleep during astral travel. I know the body lays there slumped over and non-responsive but it’s like my physical body gets so comfy in that position that it actually falls asleep on me and when that happens I am immediately sucked back into my body, open my eyes, and feel like I just woke up from a long nap at which point, observing a clock reveals that I have indeed been out of it for 3-4 hours which only felt like 20 minutes outside of my body. I open my eyes sit up and can only remember the first 10 minutes or so of my travels, and everything else is a blur like when you wake up in the morning and think what a strange dream but as you are recalling the details suddenly the entire dream slips from your memory and you’re like wait, what was I just thinking about?

The is not the same as falling asleep while sitting up in front of your altar during an evocation, this is my body going into complete sleep with paralyzing chemicals and all being released by my brain at which point I am immediately returned to my body and I wake up with over half of my astral experiences erased and only some of what happened returns to me the next day in a visual.

That’s awesome, I always try to encourage people to learn the core shamanic technique precisely because these kinds of methods do lead to such rapid changes in state, so I’m familiar with this issue (even if your own method differs) - there’s not usually a simple answer, but journeying sitting upright on a hard chair, for example, or making sure to do it in the mornings/when wide awake, can help prevent the body producing sleep chemicals (melatonin etc) when your awareness is elsewhere occupied.

Blue light, including from TV, monitor, and phone screens, has a somewhat suppressing effect on melatonin release and sleep onset, so timing your exposure to blue light (have a short walk maybe just before a journeying session) or playing a computer game with a mostly-white background for 20m beforehand might help.

Make sure you’re generally well-rested too, otherwise if you have a sleep-debt, your bod thinks “Well she’s away with her crazy ideas, let’s get some maintenance done” and starts churning out the hormones.

Basically look up everything recommended for insomnia, and do the opposite - drink caffeine, DON’T have a hot bath before, and then allow your body to cool down, get lots of blue light exposure, and so on.

Oh and in core shamanism people use “sonic drivers” which is a posh way for saying various types of repetitive noise, usually drumming or rattling at specific tempos.

These help superficially to alter your brainwaves to a trance-inducing state, but then when you get very deep, which it sounds like you’re doing, the actual soundwaves themselves (probably more accurately, your neural response to them) becomes the “horse” as in the vehicle you ride to keep your consciousness sharp during what’s otherwise a kind of trance or faint.

So try that, and if you can find any drumming circles, where people drum with those big frame drums, that is absolutely wonderful (the sound they make meshes and you begin to hear your name and other words chanted in the echoes), but the free drumming tracks on YT etc are also pretty decent, and any kind of sonic driver that works for you should help you mind falling over the line into sleep.

What she said.I’ll elaborate a bit,though on my own experiences.

So,you’ve bought Questing After Visions,and there’s an article there,called Musical Induction,which says that music is often too relaxing for trances,and that the proper 4.5 beats per second music that’s best is very hard to find.

I agree…to a degree.Too relaxing music,does make you fall asleep easier.However,in my experience,music is one of my favorite trance entering methods.Some of it just drags me down into meditation,whereas others keep me so conscious.

So despite what EA says,I say use music.And the ‘‘shamanic drumming circle’’ music,the sonic drivers,not only have an effect on the mind,but they also add a degree of novelty.

Drugs and visions are a complicated subject I’m not gonna tackle here.

I can talk more on shamanic core journeying but I’m too sleepy to type,so I’ll talk more about it on another occasion,…

Just realised I left out two useful thingsa:

  1. keep a voice recorder running, that way when you see a green dude with two heads sitting on a throne (or something) you can quickly say “green, two heads, big throne” and then that will help jog your memory when you return to normality - you may occasionally pick up interesting noises on the recordings, too;

  2. ask the spirits themselves what will help with this, they may do a ritual dismemberment or something to change up your energy so it’s less of a problem.

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I haven’t even gotten to the parts with any exercises in QAV, still in the beginning first few chapters but I have been experimenting with music because the isochronic tones set at 5 hertz just put me right to sleep probably the type of sleep where I am drooling am snoring or something.

But experimentation with my own music has lead me to discover that some of my beats do put me in a light to moderate trance so I decided to create some beats without the singing and without the synth overlays this time which turned out well however, when I discovered that my music software allows me to create 4.5 beats per second tones the first two I created I liked so well I ended up turning them into regular songs to create an odd but unique track.

Going to try this again and this time, not turn them into full on songs! The last few times this happened and I fell asleep I had my fan going as usual but the A/C also kicked on so I had white noise coming from one fan and 2 vents in my room but that shouldn’t have been a problem because I keep white noise going all day long to drown out everything else because everyday sounds such as chewing, thumping, throat clearing, slurrping just drives me batshit insane. I think my problem may be getting too comfy before hand. Even if I sit up straight if I am sitting on my bed with comfy pillows behind my back, off I go to LaLa land.

So I will try it again tonight in a hard ass wooden chair.

So I tried this again yesterday evening and I felt my body falling asleep again because I was so out of it I actually saw my body sitting on the chair this time, viewing myself as an onlooker but that’s not what snapped me back awake. I felt my physical body starting to spin as if I was levitating off my chair and was spinning in circles. It made me kind of dizzy whilst in my visual and I started feeling that heavy pull like my body was saying come back or I’m going to fall asleep so you’ll have no choice but to come back.

So I dismissed myself from the others amongst me and willfully came back to my body, waking up. I imagine this is going to take some heavy training on my part to make my body realize I want to stay in my astral world not fall asleep every time as I have heard many others say that the body is not used to the soul wanting to leave so it can sometimes take some heavy reconditioning to keep this from happening and convince your body that it will be fine without the soul long enough for me to leave and explore.

That fits with my exp[erience fwiw, it took a while - do ask some spirits they may be able to assist with the energy shifts needed.

I haven’t tried this myself, but it’s a recommended technique from one of Castaneda’s books. At the very least, it should prevent your body from slumping over and getting so tired.

"Facilitating the advent of inner silence: Sit down on one’s bed, with the knees bent and the soles of the feet touching, the hands pushing the feet together by holding the ankles. Place a thick, fourteen-inch dowel between the feet and place the other end, which is cushioned, against the middle of the forehead. Then fall asleep in this position. (12,7,113-114) "

Interesting RA - IMHO I dont think it would be possible to experience Shamanic paths without the very same drugs that they use to be honest. Buddhism, Hinduism meditation all allude to astral projection as a natural effect of progression with your meditational technique. E A’s course of course is out there - R Bruce and Mumfords Chakra and Kundalini workbook all deal with it.

In Witchcraft (I have a witchcraft book the first one I bought when I was 15 (46 now) uses the old fashionned way of hyper ventilation. This of course is similar to dance or even chant essentially just a bit more direct. Who didnt hyper ventilate when one was a child to experience unconsciousness.


I have tried it with drugs. I don’t know where to get the heavy stuff that people talk about like LSD, Peyote, etc. but I use DXM. I get the pure stuff and it’s a hallucinogen that will make you trip balls if you take enough. I have yet to take enough to really trip balls as I am surrounded by others in my home and they would probably notice me walking thru the house zoning out and claiming to be talking to a demon LOL. But taking a smaller amount gives me some good effects but not enough for my family to notice anything off about me.

But I take just enough to lose touch with reality and really feel like I’m part of my surroundings instead of just in them. It enhances my visions, allows me to communicate with my patron spirits so much easier, I mean I usually have to try somewhat to evoke them in my mind but when I take this stuff I swear I can just think of that entity and they instantly appear. When I see them, their body usually fades in and out somewhat but on this stuff they are clear as day as if standing before me like a real human.

I don’t do this every day just every so often but when I do I have the best experiences ever with my spirits, so much more personal and concise conversations.

Hello Dear @Lady_Eva I am close to the shaman tecniques because of mu roots.
Can you help me about something?
How do I improve my astral core over someone?
I already had a connection by mistake.