It does take a degree of indoctrination and conditioning to accept any kind of dogma in the first place. All dogma is is a set of ideas, rules, theories, etc, set forth by an accepted authority figure, which are held as incontroversial. The belief that dogma does not exist is definitely dogma, because dogma can be observed on paper. So, if one were to believe that dogma does not exist it would definitely be symptomatic of dogmatic thinking, anyways.
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Exactly. Dogma also very often goes hand in hand with cognitive dissonance.
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@Mouchany When most people think of the word “dogma,” their minds conjure images of narrow-mindedness, rigidity, fanaticism, and refusal to think for oneself; in fact the popular meaning of the word entails all these things. Fortunately, I’m not using the word in its popular sense but in its technical one.
In its technical sense, the word “dogma” has none of the meanings found in the popular use. Rather, it simply means what a person or group asserts to be true.
In the sense of an individual, your dogma is what you personally believe to be unshakably true.
As an example, if you talk to the average Neopagan or Newager – people who claim to have no dogma whatsoever – you’ll find that most of them have an unshakeable belief in reincarnation. This unshakeable belief is their personal dogma, and likewise has the potential to shape any number of their other beliefs on religious, spiritual, and social issues.
What I’m saying is that every person has at least one unshakeable belief, therefore every person holds at least one dogma. Even if their dogma is the insistence on being non-dogmatic about everything: there is no person who lacks a core belief or a core principle.
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Okay. I think this will be a case where we will have to agree to disagree then, because I don’t think you use the word dogma correctly.
Okay that’s cool 
Though maybe you are referring to something like this
"corporate dogma, a term I’m using to describe “official dogmata” of a church, group, or organization.
Corporate dogmata differ little from personal dogmata except that it’s the official expression of a group of people. When Christianity affirms “there is one God in three persons” or Buddhism asserts that “The cause of suffering is desire,” each is expressing the corporate dogma of their respective religion. In fact there is nothing wrong with this insofar as we’re talking about expressions of belief (what dogma is) without falling into fanaticism (something dogma can lead to)."
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No. I am referring to dogma as being indoctrination. When you look at the different senses, for instance, we as humans perceive the world, the universe etc. with, you should know that that is not the only way. We know, if we think about it, that our senses are just a part of other ways of sensing on a spectrum. A dog can sense more with its nose just as an example. And everyone senses the world in a different way. Dogma removes the neutral aspect of that, meaning that that is just how I am, and replaces it with a rigid template that will also very often install hierarchical thinking, language etc. So someone who aspires to be as free a spirit as possible will always try to avoid dogma. So dogma is an indoctrinating way of experiencing.
One thing to add to that is that it leads you to one, important conclusion: There are no gurus.
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Magick, unless Im mistaken, was the coined term by Crowley to set himself apart from other ceremonial magic organizations.
I have pictures that show orbs of floating light in different colors, after calling on various demons/demonesses. In reviewing pictures taken after rituals, other people saw not only that but other beings in the room that I had missed. Whenever that occurs, I try to validate and think logically as to to why this or that occurs. I could come up with no valid explanation. Then there is the case of behavioral changes in those around me after rituals, even though I took safeguards except for a circle and triangle.
In breathing exercises, I once saw shadows of flame moving on the trimboard of the room after going up to 14 seconds for inhale, hold, exhale, pause. Once I observed this, the only reaction I took was to note in my mind that it had occurred, and slowly brought my breathing down to a count of 2, opened my eyes, and carefully sat up. After that I took in all logical possibilities for it occurring and found none.
Let me ask this to you … Don’t you find the Gray matter between your ears a bit amazing? Have you stretched that to the bounds of its capabilities?
I’ve worked with both angels and demons, and yes, they will show up and give you a sign of their arrival.
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“Those who don’t believe in magic will never find it.”
― Roald Dahl
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Then why are you here then? It seems you were here to start some trouble. Seems l doubt you are here on legitimate purposes.
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I can’t even argue with this kind of people. There are to many of them and why would we lose our precious time with someone like this… dear poor soul.
She has mentioned science as a kind of evidence but has no idea that CERN scientists for instance, experiment much about it and still seeking to unlock the mysteries of our universe. They claim that 95% of the universe in still unknown but in my humble, ignorant 
opinion, it’s all about mystery. There is much more unknown yet they’ve spent billions to understand just a small part of it. What’s a science then but pure magick in this case?
And how to explain to this person that I for instance, met spirits since my early age, was talking to my close relatives after only a few weeks after they passed away, that an Archangel came to me in the middle of the day just because he wanted so, yet I was calling it LIFE, not magick. But truth is, it’s both life and magick, depends on your point of view.
To explain to her that in such a short period after I 1st time came here to BALG, am able to communicate with spirits, using my will and as I move further I realize I don’t need all that tools but my mind, my eyes, yes, open eyes and ears… and not to mention scrying tools and similar… Yet… this is just my very beginning. Years ago I knew because of my senses, I felt it but seriously, haven’t take much action on it. Acting is magick.
The thing is - such people need some damn stressful proof to shake them hard to start believing it. And what’s the point? Loosing someones precious time.
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Oh you’ll know magick magick is real when you wake up with black fire standing on your paralyzed body looking down upon you with a sinister grin… BEEN THERE… …that was about eight years ago. These days they don’t send me into shock chivers and cold sweat upon walking into the room. As a matter of fact, I’ve grown quite accustomed to the extreme terror and flight I feel being in their presense. Believe me… the terror you feel shall exceed any terror you have known… every time you meet them. Which means the terror actually gets worse. Which further means you have to have your shit together quick or they will race you to your own center and you’ll wake up surrounded by laughing demons as you wail and claw at the corner of your room completely out of your mind… …been there too bud… I’ve been everywhere man I’ve been everywhere whistles a tune while snaping fingers
72nd comment. Goetia is on my side buwhahaha!!!
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I guess I picked a great first topic to join the group on lol
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I would like to apologize for being a jerk and insulting your beliefs. I do have something to say: don’t just insult me and tell me that I’m being manipulated, because you’re not doing any better than I was, you are just insulting me for what I believe, which is exactly what I was doing. And as we’ve seen, it was terrible, I didn’t do any better for myself. What I’m saying is never fight fire with fire because you’ll just add to the damage. But some people were very reasonable and explained why they’re here and why they belive in etc. Which was nice to see and made me realize that I did the bad thing. So again, I apologize and I won’t do this again.
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Expertiences, not beliefs mate - this isn’t a cult, magick is about results and experiences, even peer-testing stuff to some extent, not “have faith and don’t blaspheme our sacred feels”! 
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So, seeing as your account is still active and this comment was only 13 hours ago at this point, I guess I’ll put my bit in. Going by that “health and meditation” bit, what I wanted to say was that meditation is, as someone else here said, the basis of most, if not all magick. It gets your mind in the position to actually use magick. They’ve even found, through tests, that meditation brings about a new neurological state of the brain, and it’s in that state that our minds and senses are altered and we can do our workings. All of this, explained fully or not, actually has a scientific basis, even if just a small one at this point.
Little side note on the spelling: the K was added to separate this magick, from the magic done on stages for performance art. And I’ve heard all the “you can’t just change things like that,” and my response has always been to point out that that’s how language evolves to begin with. Not saying you were going to say anything like that, just adding that in.
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One day, maybe.
You’ll be smart enough to actually try something outside of your belief system and reap the results.
Because you know - science will allow you to travel into an astral plane. 
Sorry, I didn’t mean it in a bad way. I meant that you experience something, so you believe in it.
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