There has been people who wanted to map the astral but the collective unconscious/mental plane is ever changing. Many places in the astral don’t stay the same and people can simply create new places as well. So to map it would be to constantly change it based on the collective unconscious of every being capable of thought.
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Do egregores ever try to incarnate under aliases? You how ghost writing is when a writer writes under an alias. Do egregores act as characters in stories under an alias?
Egregores can’t reincarnate, the difference between an egregore and a ‘real’ being is a soul. Of course the creator of an egregore could fragment their own and give it to the egregore so it starts as a “new” soul, thus allowing it to reincarnate/incarnate. However, other than that, they are within the confines of the astral, when evoked or invoked it’s purely taking place within the mind, even to evoke outside of you is within the mind, which is different from evoking a ‘real’ being who can appear outside of you or within.
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Is soul synonyms with body?
Soul is synonyms with spirit.
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Egregore,
has little to do with it being a god, deity, spirit, angel or demon.
Egregore, techniqually is a degree of worship / influence.
The ranking goes something like this:
Thoughtform, construct. - little power, usually created accidentially (subconcious) or without fully lining out the details of it’s properties.
It’s like an animal, so to say, having little conciousness,
and often being food for other beings which are more developed.
Tulpa: A tulpa is usually left behind when a real person - that means a person with an intact soul - goes through the normal process of death and - potential reincarnation - but is shedded into fractions of itself, during the passing stage, of ascending back into source.
This can also happen with some more advanced beings which aren’t human, but pure spirit, yet have a presence on various planes of existance simotaneously.
A Tulpa, is more or less what commonly is called “Ghost”.
It’s a shell, a left over piece of that being, resembling some knowledge and awareness, even potential inluence on the physical plane, but not reliable as of living beings.
Tulpas can be placed into ghouls,
but that comes with the huge drawback that it’s still an completely undead being, and the ghoul / Zombie doesn’t really have advanced thinking, memory and abilities.
Such zombies can be used to fulfill smaller tasks, working labor, but ideally the task should be monotone and simple. Since to advanced tasks will simply be ignored or done wrong.
The other usage of the term Tulpa, actually means small version of Servator,
so i’ll rep it into the next describtion:
A Sevator, or Serviator (as i use to call it), is a designed, artificially created being.
That can rank from small imp or creature, up to full blown god.
A Tulpa Servator, in that sense, means a spirit that only got it’s base frame and is supposed to fulfill one, or a few small task, and then wither away once it’s fulfilled it’s purpose.
That’s also where the drawing on the term tulpa comes from: It’s natrual, inherrent tendency to wither away, when it’s not sustained or after fulfilling it’s duty.
Those are usually created by a single mage / witch, and only obey their direct master,
unless they come in contact with massively higher ranked beings, which at least a few, natrually have complete authority over such beings. To give an example: Lucifer, Satan, Lucifuge Rofocale. In a more broader sense: Royal Leaders, which have influence beyond their own legion into other spirits.
The next stronger version is the normal Servator.
It is the creation of one or a few mages. It can interact with reality, as defined by it’s creator, will fulfill one, a few or many tasks, both simple and advanced, and it will do so reliably. It requires Energy supply and that can be given either through gratitude towards it, or through other sources of Energy; those can, but must not, include: Sacrifices, Life Energy, specific Emotions, natural occuring Elements (especially reliable on elemental spirits), if tasked specifically, such spirits can be provided with other Spiritual creatures for food, or even feed directly on their target / victim / enemy they’re working on / fighting against.
Next to that, we have the Serviator, which, as a term isn’t used much, and as far as i know isn’t reliably embedded in the general understanding. The Serviator, unlike a Servator, has a distinct sense of identity, and feels in charge of the tasks given to him. It has a higher likelyhood of survival, even when it’s seperated from it’s creator for extended periods. Drawback of it: it may refuse commands or not want to do certain actions. Since Servators / Serviators are usually created through the Energy of it’s creator and draw most skills and knowledge from their Creator (basically the Servator can do what you can do, to an extend, but can’t do thinks you’re completly foreign to), that can be a problem when the task given to the servator for example conflicts with the personal morals or understanding of what is right and what is wrong to do.
In such fashion, a Serviator may refuse to do a task, or do it differently than what the original creator of it anticipated.
However,
that is of little concern, when installing the JaJuJi code into it,
which allows for later adjustment.
In such a case, the task which is refused, could be analyzed and the missing protocolls, moral ideals etc. can be added as needed.
However, that process might surrender the Being unfunctionable and lead to it’s destruction (usually through re-incarnation into it’s source, which is the mage which created it, so thereby it can easily trasnfair the problem onto the mage which made the servator.)
To prevent that, the Servator can be shed into fractions (like described above, similar to how human desintegration works), and by sending each fraction to it’s specific origin, the corruption of the creator of the servator can be prevented. A Servator which has reliable food supply, may outlive his creator.
At that point, it can either be surrendered solumn, and inhabit a area (either astral or abyssal, for most cases), until it’s either running out of supplies, has finished it’s task and tries to desintegrate (dies), or is being collected into one of the Legions.
Egregores - Nethers
An Egregore creation requires several Mages working combined together on that one specific goal,
and their unicin is necessary for it. Period.
There is NO Egregore creation by single mages.
Why?
Because of the Influence.
However, advanced beings - Like Azazel or Lucifuge Rofocale - can create Nethers, which i would rank roughly equally strong.
Those Spirits, that rank around Egregoric / Netherian Level, are usually not alone. They usually have Legions of lower spirits serving them. Wether that’s adressed by the creator or founded by themselves out of their power (a Nether which isn’t given a Legion, will start assembling or creating one, to fulfill it’s tasks relaibly), these spirits usually hold vast abilities and capabilities, usually easily outperforming any regular human or spirit they come in contact with.
Techniqually, all gods could be ranked into that region. However,
i highly suggest not to do so.
While those beings are clearly stronger and more advanced, knowlegable and can work indipendently for huge amounts of time (/ much longer than a human sorcerer may live by itself), they’re normally not natrually gods.
The most common case, for them to become a god, and directly feed from worship - which indeed is one of the forms a Spirit can be fed, but not recommendable for lower levels below servator, is due to reactions of lower beings to their actions.
Egregores and Nethers usually appear changing events and circumstances at a scope a human can barely comprehend. Thereby, they start being recognized, because the human feels / knows there is influence and presence working on something, but only after connecting with that being, or wittnessing it for a while, worship and other forms of exchange between the spirit and the lower beings may start to develope.
Now, bear in mind that the term “lower beings” also refers to the concept of pure spirit being “above” the physical plane, or simply reality, the world we humans live in, because that concept is widely spread as a basis of understanding the other worlds around this one.
However, it’s comparising, an attempt of making sense of these things.
Not how it really is.
a Human, which studies and practices skills that are normally used by spirits, - or simpler said, a Witch / Magician, will at some point be able to interact with spiritual beings on an eye to eye level.
And therefore, not be considered lower, or “devotee - supposed to worship” anymore.
Generally, it’s advisable for any magician with deep and intense goals to stick to the general rule of approaching any being from an equal perspective, and then recognizing the apropriate behavior based on interaction, or even avoiding worship of spirits.
Why is that?
Spirits can exchange and bestow / take powers in their work with Mages.
However, when worshipping a being, you’re normally ending up fulfilling their tasks, and being bound into their legion, and many don’t recognize that for a long period of time.
Such agreements can still be valuable, benefitial for the Human, etc.
I just recommend this as a general rule, to be more aware of those interactions.
Because, unlike what many think, a sacrifice isn’t like paying at the counter.
It’s an energetic exchange, yes.
But spirits usually don’t tell you motives of employing you back for calling upon them,
unless it’s adressed by you.
To make that a little bit more clear and understandable:
You’re talking to Lucifer.
Lucifer is in charge of All Demons (dark beings) in existance.
You ask Lucifer to get you your ex spouse back.
Lucifer agrees, and says “sure, no problem.”
a few weeks later, the relationship is flurishing well again.
Now,
another mage talks to lucifer and tells him:
Hey, i wanted that guy to be gone, now he’s back,
can you please fix this? i can’t stand seeing him,
after what he’s done to me during school,
get him out of my face.
Now lucifer haves a couple of options here,
like killing your spouse as commanded by Sorcerer Number two,
or getting you and your spouse to move away,
or simply interrupting you in your tracks,
and making you desire to move away and take that spouse with you.
As you notice,
the last option has a “win-win” condition,
of fulfilling both requests and getting a completely new situation at hand.
However, the likelyhood to go ahead and move location,
while you’re happy from being back into the relationship you missed,
may be very low.
At that point,
lucifer haves increased influence on you,
because he’s helped you before,
and his actions are considered genuine in your mind,
for the results you’re currently expieriencing.
So it’s much simpler to for him,
to tell you: hey by the way,
this other guy over there doesn’t like your spouse to be around!
Please do something about it.
And voila.
You’re employed by the spirit,
you’ve just worked with,
because now,
to continue good buisness,
he is giving you the decision process,
of solving the issue between sorcerer 2 and your spouse.
Now,
don’t get me wrong,
i DO NOT MEAN a specific case i witnessed here on balg.
But i’m just trying to give an example,
and make it as relatable as possible,
for people to understand the process / effects.
The spirit is still working towards the best interest of the mages here.
At the same time,
it’s using it’s natrual influence,
and that brings us back to the worship thing:
Through worship,
you’re giving access to that what you worship,
into yourself.
That’s where things like self-deification rites come into play,
for example.
In a Self-deification rite,
you’re giving yourself more access to your own life and circumstances,
but you’re also gathering spirits of the lower degrees,
and people,
to work on your behalf,
and fulfill your requests,
in order to serve bigger goals both for those worshipping you / working with you,
aswell as for yourself.
There is techniqually another level,
which would be “the outer planes”, “the ancient ones” etc,
there’s several terms adressing the next type of beings.
But again,
let me sum it up as easy as possible:
Older than humanity.
Usually not thinking, acting, behaving anything similar to humans,
unless being in exchange with them for a long period of time,
and therefore grown “familiar” with the way humans are.
Beings like Nyarlathotep count into that direction.
These are usually leaders even amongst the kings.
Where a Royal Leader can lead lower spirits,
these can lead higher spirits aswell.
They actually don’t even care / bother with,
lower spirits usually.
Their appearance is more likely to be difficult to be comprehended,
than to be well understood,
by the medium / mage percieving it.
These beings mainly exist in planes outside of our normal understanding of reality.
A-Coporeal Beings like those,
may have influence on the world,
but usually that’s not the thing that’s most reliable or easy to work with in them.
These are mainly used for Learning, Guidiance (/which by the way, the request of guidiance is very similar to what i wrote about worship. When you ask a Spirit to guide you, it also takes charge of directing you, and to a degree you’re accessable as an aspect of their legion, for the time of you following their guidiance. again, another way of getting the spirit to give you tasks, and make you do things, instead of you giving the spirit tasks, and make it act on your behalf.) or for gaining knowledge that isn’t accessable through any other medium.
The oldest beings,
simply natrually hold / tap into knowlege,
that others may never even wittness throughout their entire lifespan.
However, the occult understanding of those terms is, and has been shifting aswell.
These are no fully reliable Definitions,
as many authors would frame it and sell it for people to then rely on it.
The terms should,
however,
alongwith the explenation i gave,
give you a good basic understanding,
of whats going on,
so you notice:
Oh, that being is 20 times as big as my house,
speaks in undiscernable voices, and doesn’t resemble a form i can determine clearly?
Probably something ancient.
Oh, that being is lethargic, loves sticking to boring repetive tasks, and comes by the same place again and again?
Propably a tulpa, a Ghost.
Hmmm,
this one acts on it’s own,
clearly works on specific, complex tasks and isn’t human,
nor does it resemble human form?
That, is likely to be a servator.
Or, if it’s not, it may be a natrual inahabitant of the Astral plane,
which would make it a spirit.
- The term spirit,
is usually used in reference to all the kinds i listed above,
aswell as some i didn’t.
Just to add a few examples:
Holy Guardian Angel (personal higher self);
Personal Demon (Subconcious, animalistic aspect of you, that keeps you alive);
Godform - a projected shell / image / representation of a living or non-living being, that reached skills similar to those of Gods / could be, or is being worshipped and can sustain itself based on that Worship.
an infernal newborn: Demonic Imp, Born recently, most often not in the Abyss itself, but rather here on this plane.
celestial newborn: The opposite of the Demonic imp, a celestial newborn is born from the “holy” source, another kind of half-breed, or incarnated celestial (heck, that’s even where the term stems from), a Spiritual being living in the flesh.
Celestial / Infernal Hybrid: Being that has access into both energies. Humans fall into that category. Most Physical, fully created things do. Since most things in the Physical world, rely on the combination of the two primordeal forces /(wells), in order to even exist.
Beings that believe to stem from the one, and only source.
/apart from being a little bit off, for my understanding,
they’re not really wrong either.
The “one” source, still is true,
when viewed from a different perspective.
Since for them,
The Abyss isn’t a Source,
but simply a sideeffect of reality.
However, in their understanding,
God lived and stemmed from the Abyss aswell.
For their describtion begins with:
At the beginning, there was only god.
Then god spoke, “let there be light”,
and there was light.
Which,
when you just read back up,
easily defines as an Ancient giving a Command,
and having it fullfilled by it’s Legions.
So,
Maybe this helps for better understanding here.
Regarding the Athestic Aproach - I’m sorry, that human concept doesn’t really make sense to me either.
You’re decision, wether you consider the air you breathe to be existant, or not, doesn’t bother a the air very much, does it?
You’re still breathing it,
and when you stop doing so,
you’re not sustained anymore anyways.
So,
how is it importend wether the Human can recognize the Air he breathes to be real or not?
Well, if he wants to drive a baloon, or fly an Airplane,
it becomes quite importend,
but unless someone actually engages with it,
meh*
whatever.
Which brings us to one of the last categories:
Oversouls.
Oversouls are mainly governing,
non-incarnated beings.
The Oversoul of Earth for example,
would be Gaya. (Goddess Earth).
Other Oversouls are Other Planetary Spirits,
and - once that’s more researched,
Galaxial Spirits aswell.
There are other Planes of existance,
like the Abyss or Celestia,
which also have oversouls.
For the Abyss,
the Oversoul most may be familiar with,
would be Choronzon.
For Celestia,
I’m sorry, i currently don’t remember the exact name.
(But that would be RHP - Monotheistic view anyway, which would lead us back to the dicotamy i’ve tried to avoid and keep to a minimum in my explenations here.)
Sincerely,
¥’Berion
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I think you may not be giving Hecate enough credit. I’ve found there’s a scale of aspects to her. She has her own mysteries at each aspect. Mr. Smith mentions some people are not meant for the draconian path they get a doorway to work in another aspect. But just the vibe from Mark Allen Smith, he seems like he fits. Plus he’s a vet and I can tell has been through some ish. I respect his work ethic and devotion a lot. But no, devotional work doesn’t appeal to everyone.
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Im hinging on the idea they are eggregores here
so
Can one utilize the sigils of an entity to tap those energies to power something like a personal servitor or event??? Say I grabbed a hundred sigils of entities, and decided to tap all of em to power …iduuno, say an event occuring or a servitor that serves a purpose, would such work? (if in fact it doesn’t piss the entities off)
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Yes, however, you’d be drawing energy from that entity with their permission because you can’t just simply take energy and expect them to agree or disagree.
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I don’t understand.
Any being that we can perceive tangibly/flesh and blood is not a spirit therefore is not a soul?
An egregore isn’t a spirit by the same sense, an egregore is considered a spirit only because some people grow attached to their egregores/servitors to a point they consider them real living beings. Egregores are thoughtforms and thoughtforms dont have souls.
Thoughtforms dont have souls, they live off attention and fade when they aren’t given it. So the difference between us and egregores is a soul. However, giving an egregore a soul ceases them from existing as an egregore and more as a living being.
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The difference between us and egregores are souls and the difference between us and spirits is tangibly/flesh on our plane?
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The difference between us and spirits yes, they can’t fully manifest here due to the density of this plane being so compact/slow. However, if we project to the etheric/spiritual plane, our energy bodies will adjust to that density and we become semi-physical in their plane, that allows us better interaction.
I theorize because their density is not as compact we can manifest there in that semi-physical form of our energy bodies.
to us this plane is our physical and the spiritual plane is energy, to them their plane is their physical and ours is just another denser physical if that makes sense to you.
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Yes, you explained the physics well and I understand what you mean. That would mean that egregores must have tangibly/flesh on our plane.
Not at all, egregores exist on the astral, the astral is the realm of thoughts/imagination, they manifest through our mindscapes, basically like an hallucination. However, you can link a egregore to a physical object as a representation of them, but no the astral density is far less compact compared to our plane and the spiritual plane, because it’s the realm of thoughts, fears, dreams, etc manifest within that plane.
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We have this plane, at least one spiritual plane, and an astral plane for our plane and every spiritual plane?
The amount of planes people have different views on honestly. but the astral is connected to every other too.
Question, but couldn’t soul as one calls it extend from the magickian into the thoughtform eggregore? Like a split off of one’s personality given life?(working experiment)
I mean a soul is like ur energetic, informational signature right? I assume a servitor would have the creator’s of it’s imprint all over it. I mean it came from ur mind, with your astral energy, mental signature…why wouldn’t it have a soul?
The servitors I refer to would operate influencing or exerting effects on the physical realm, which is of the mind???..i think since its a mental universe
A servitor/thoughtform has the creator’s energy, which allows a person to trace the servitor back to it’s creator but that’s not the same as having a soul, the creator has to actively fragment their soul and give it to the servitor/thoughtform, it’s not automatic. A thoughtform/servitor doesn’t develop a personality it simply has one of the creator’s sub personalities.
We all have subpersonalities that we are and aren’t aware of, that shows in different situations or not at all because the circumstances doesnt allow for it to show itself.
Just because something comes from your mind doesn’t mean it will have a soul, none of my constructs which are made from my energy manipulation have a soul, for a thoughtform/egregore to work on the physical they have to work through you, through your mind. You have a soul, they don’t they are the equivalent to semi-flexible robots, they cease to exist once you forget about them, or all who created the egregore forget about it or it becomes a parasite.
However, if a creator(s) fragment their soul and give it to the servitor, the servitor becomes completely independent, it’s own energy signature, energy body, soul, personality, it’s own life entirely separate from you.
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Could you please explain soul fragmentation?
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