I wanted to start this topic, because I’m curious as to how you all feel about being ethical in the lhp. Where does morality come in to play, and when and where is the line drawn.
I’m currently debating that very question with myself today over my neighbor whom I have a shared yard with. The woman is in her sixties, has cancer and is going through chemo, she has been widowed for two years, her mother just passed away last month. And things have slowly gone down hill between us for the last several months.
When we first moved into our place she was helpful and nice. Helped me get baby clothes And items when I had none and was 7 months pregnant. I was very thankful and we actually had a good relationship with her.
And recently Back before she found out she had cancer and lost her mom she had started to do some underhanded stuff to stir the pot. Most of it little annoying stuff.
But the main thing that caused the contention was after My husband offered to help fix somethings in her house for free but told her specifically that she needed to buy the materials for this project. which she understood and agreed to. Well She never bought the materials, and then kept pestering my husband about when he would get to it. At that time my husband was busy with paid work, when my husband reminded her of that in his less than sensative manner, that she needed to buy the materials before he would fix anything she acted as if she didnt know what he was talking about, and then she went around and started to tell our other neighbors how he didnt fix this stuff for her after he said he would.
That really pissed my husband off and he straight up said to have someone else do the work. Then she would text me ask why my husband was so upset. What did she do wrong Etc.
Shit cooled off for a little and she minded her own business for a while. Then she got bored or something.
Cause she started to let her dogs out at all hours of the night and early morning to go potty, and they are tiny yappie ankle biters and they bark until she lets them in… Which takes her a while.
My husband is a light sleeper, so are my kids. The dogs kept them up. They were all crabby and i had to deal with the aftermath. So I texted her and asked her to please stop letting her dogs out at all hours of the night because everyone can fricken hear them. And just because everyone else maybe too polite to say something about it, my autistic ass is not especially since I’m dealing with cranky ass kids and husband, and that the dogs still bother everyone to hear all hours of the night and to please do something about it.
She then texted me letting me know she had just found out she had cancer and didnt need to have this stress.
Which I felt like a major douche after that. 🤦 but the petty shit continued. But the dogs didn’t bark at all hours of the night.
About a month after that I asked if she cared if i used the shared garden plots to plant this year. Had already asked the landlord. No issues.
Then she texts me back letting me know she is in the hospital and her mom had just passed away.
Now I really feel like an asshole. I offer my condolences. And refrained from asking if that meant yes I could plant.
Waited some more time. Now its getting warmer so I’m getting my yard ready to plant. Cleaned the massive amount of dog crap up in the yard because obviously she has not been feeling well and hasnt been able to get to it. so im not gonna bitch about it and be more of an asshole, I’ll just clean it up and treat the yard like I own it. I just tell myself i dont want my kids running around and stepping in any of this shit that will then be drug into the house for me to also clean up later.
That was short lived patience and understanding because then i started to clean back behind my house where we had a deck, which we took down last summer due to it being a safety hazard needing severe repair, to start getting things ready for spring and gardening. I started raking by the house and door, which I have blacked out with curtains to help keep heat it, and found a few grocery bags turned over covering their contents…lifted them up and found out they were filled with dog shit. So immediately thought of her. Filled with rage…Then felt like a huge asshole for assuming that. But logically she is the only one with dogs and she uses grocery bags for their poop and walks by that corner of my house several times a day to get her mail or go for a walk. So it was more of 2+2=4 kinda thing.
So now I’m contemplating making her life worse because she left her dog shit hy my back door or just letting her be miserable and unhappy as she already seems to do it to herself.
And i already kinda feel guilty for her having all this bad luck, as it seemed to start after I removed my ex husbands hex and put up a bunch of return to sender defenses that were just general protections against anyone who would act with malice towards me or my family.
So 🤷 who knows at this point on what’s really going on with her or if I’m the cause, but my ethics get in the way a lot as id really like to be super petty right now towards her but i can’t consciously will myself to do it. And i have to much guilt associated with it because she has had all this shit happen to her recently.
You just need to do minor magick for this without demons. I hear ya, have dealt with pesky neighbors in the past, and just in case she’s just old and pissed due to her circumstances, you don’t need to bring out the big guns for this. Some ppl believe bindings are dark magick, but sometimes it’s necessary to prevent something worse. How much are you gonna be able to take? How much can she if you go off lol.
So a binding spell, and stop slander spell, so she won’t go around talking crap to your neighbors etc. I would go all out and use Hekate for the binding, why not shell get the job done, and then do a stop slander spell.
It’s kinda obvious she’s doing this on purpose. Hekate will help you if you’re in the right.
What kind of cancer does she have?
A severe sickness can change peoples’ personality and behaviour. I saw that happening in a relative who suffered from a brain tumor.
In order to not derail this thread by just answering to @anon482649:
My standarts for morality are kinda high.
I think people nowadays tend to throw curses at people over nothing, when they could also just cut the cords and move away.
That’s my opinion, and everyone has to decide for themselves I guess.
But don’t forget, even if you let an entity do the job, you are still responsible for what happens. Whatever that means.
It very much depends on the individual. To make my answer a little easier to explain, I am going to focus on cursing.
For me, I play by whatever means the situation calls. Over kill is something I tend to strive to avoid, as I am more an eye for an eye kind of guy. So generational curses are off the table for me, as it goes long past the actual issue. I have zero problem using the weaknesses of my enemy to get rid of them, as it is the easiest path for magic to follow.
I don’t think the spells you cast blew back on you. Maybe she was a phony nice person, plenty of phonies out there.
She has breast cancer. They found a small tumor and removed it then had her on 4 weeks of the heavy chemo and are doing 12 weeks of the follow up chemo. She is supposed to have a high chance of total remission. Thats as much as i know about it.
I only follow one rule, don’t cause pain (physical or phsychological) to people who don’t deserve it. Who deserves it? People who consciously cause pain to others.
edit: I follow that rule in every aspect of my life, not just magick.
Exactly. I believe a witch, especially a dark witch is here to teach. We should try to stay on the bright side, but when a serious line is crossed it needs to be dealt with. As long as you know you haven’t done anything deliberately to offend or harm her, go for it
That’s what my husband said about her. As soon as her true colors started to come out he cut all his personal contact with her. At which point she started complaining to me over him not talking to her.
And I will use hekate to bind her and maybe help her move to a different place, and to stop the gossip. We live in a small town that shit can really hurt a self employed carpenter.
Cancer is such a complex disease. It can change hormones, or the way your immune system works. The immune system can start attacking healthy cells…
It can lead to depression, anxiety, aggressiveness, disturbance of memory…
What I’m trying to say is, I always try to understand why people act the way they do, in order make the situation better for me and them.
Of course there are lines that musn’t be crossed, like hurting an innocent person.
I’m not tolerating every behaviour because someone had a bad childhood, that’s not what I mean.
I totally agree with what your saying. That’s why I’m not gonna hex her willfully. I’ll try to work on my bad mouthing her mentally. And I do sympathize with her deeply. She has been through a lot in the last couple years. And none of her family really comes to visit her and they all live in the same town or within 30 min. So i know she is lonely.
And honestly i give people the benefit of the doubt far past what would be warrwnted, simply because im not in there head and I don’t know for certain what they are going through or thinking.
I just don’t appreciate her having been manipulative of me in the past and taking advantage of my naievity over how people work. And its taken two years for us to get this point anyway and I’m reaching my tipping point. I dont know why dog shit is my tipping point but it seems to be right now.
Existence… That’s my personal rule… Anything that obstructs or threatens that… Then you go all out
Slight tangent, but what are peoples thoughts on the ethics of psy-vampirism? How does one go about being an “ethical vamp”? One thing I read suggested that the logical end of psy vamping is energy healing, does anyone here agree with that? I am being thrust down this path and I have no want to be a person who harms others just because I can.
I was thinking about this a lot lately :’) Up until recently, I was a RHPer who has only used magick so far to heal people, remove curses, self improvement etc, until a few days ago. Long story short, there’s an organization that has actively been screwing with me and people I care about for years, and I snapped. I did a series of baneful workings against some targets, and I 100% have the intention to mind control and harm them. It’s playing out right now. There is nothing ethical about it, but I find that I don’t really care.
Is it the right thing to do? I don’t know. I’m acting out my desires and I don’t super care about using force. Now I’m sitting here trying to process it :’) I’m interested to see what LHP people think is ethical or not, or if they even care.
Ethics in the Left Hand Path is basically Do As Thou Will.
However, the caveat to that, which I think a lot of people seem to ignore, particularly beginners, is Accept All Consequences That Result from Doing Thou Will.
Some people get all curse happy, throwing around baneful energies at everyone and their dog who looks at them funny, and then wonder why their life goes to shit, people don’t like them, and they can’t manifest their desires. Or they start whining that someone is cursing them back. It’s like they think doing what they Will means they are free from the consequences of what they magically do.
Every action, even a magical one, has a reaction. If you go around punching people, sooner or later, someone is going to punch you back. Magick does not free you from the consequences of your actions, so if you’re going to be a dick, then you will receive the consequences of being a dick. That’s Life 101. Now, in magick, the reaction may not be as obvious as someone punching you back, but there will still be a reaction.
Everyone has the right to do their Will, so your targets, whether it be of baneful work or love spells, also have the right of choice, and of retaliation. A black magician accepts that as a consequence, and prepares for it.
Please note there are consequences to everything, not just baneful work. Healing brings consequences too.
My mom passed away in cancer a year and four months ago, and she was similar to your neighbour in behavior. She was way over due in her cancer and had it long before she was diagnosed with it. All though it wasn’t her fault, entirely, that she behaved the way she did, it still hurts in so many ways. Sure it’s a little different with a neighbour outside the family, but the built up trust over the years makes it quite the blow when the trust is challenged.
For many years I hated my mom, but I would never harm her because she didn’t deserve such punishment. She raised me and my siblings the best she could and she did take good care of us. Why should a few years of a strained relationship at the end of one’s life matter, when the overall experience was quite allright?
Moral and ethics in magic is unavoidable, because every decision we make is based off of it. Even if we claim to “not care” about the consequence, it’s an ethical decision per default.
I couldn’t do that to another person, there’s no way. That goes against every moral code I have. The most I will do is scan someone if they ask me to.
You are absolutely correct.