How to tell if a spirit is dishonest?
Divination is one way, but entities can like just like humans and unless you can catch if they have a telltale sign your best bet is divination.
Aren’t there Solomonic rituals to force the truth out of a spirit
You could go that route but do you really want to get on the bad side of entities that are possibly more advanced than you? because once you get the truth out of them what stops them from getting revenge?
Or don’t work with them if you think they are dishonest. I still don’t know how that idea comes up in people’s head. all i do is cast spell , hope i get my results. I don’t chit chat with them or have conversation . lol. they get my results and i’m good. nothing else matters when working with entities.
That’s because people like building bonds, not just asking them for stuff.
that’s what physical life is for. =o) i like to have my mind clear not chit chattery. silence and quiet is healing for me. i’m put here with physical body so i’m suppose to learn to use it in some way for growth. It’s more fulfilling to interact with a real person then some perception in your head. spiritual has to do with oneself not other beings.
The bonds i get from angels and demons is when i get results. haha. no results no bond. that means they not interested. on to the next demon or spells. lol
Bonds dont matter by physical or spiritual physical bonds exist on a spiritual level and always will.
Yes, forcing the answers out of a spirit is a sure fire way to make enemies. However, what I don’t actually know, I don’t fully trust. I assume they feel similarly.
I tend to do the same technique as I do with people if my gut is telling me something is off midritual: I reword the same question and see if I will get the same answer every time. If I find that it is and sense they are annoyed, I apologize and throw an offering their way for their trouble.
If your methods are good, this should never be a problem. The only times I’ve encountered this have been when I was misled into working with parasitic spirits with no real power to cause change that benefited me. I have read that attempting to work with powerful spirits through dodgy and corrupted methods can lead to you only contacting a “shadow” or false facade of a spirit. I believe that every spirit could be called an egregore, but these false spirits are like false fragments of a truly mighty spirit created through repetition and belief. The difference is that the true spirit will have the power to change you and the world to give you what you ask for and help in your personal development, whereas a parasite will just bother you for your attention (and your blood if you are dumb enough to give it to them) while giving you nothing other than perhaps a false feeling of love or power or whatever while not actually helping you, and in the worst cases actually hurting you. Parasitic spirits are just like parasitic people in this way. I have without a doubt encountered both of these types of entities.
That’s just my opinion though, and everyone’s opinion about everything is equally valid, right?
The simplest way to ensure a spirit is telling the truth is to compel them through binding.
In Solomon’s magick this is done by threats and adjurations in the name of God, but it can also be done in the name of a greater spirit in whatever hierarchy the spirit belongs to.
For example, compelling a spirit of the Goetia to speak true in the Lucifer can also work, because according to the hierarchy of the Lesser Key, Lucifer has authority over all of the 72.
Another way is to use a gateway entity. The archangel Raziel, for example, can be used to connect you to other entities (angels, demons and gods) as well as act as a guardian of sorts while you are communicating with said entity to ensure there are no shenanigans.
How about Odin, Thor, or Tyr?
What about them? Are you talking about compelling gods to speak the truth?
Unfortunately, there is no way that I know of to compel a god as they have no superior force to call upon.
I would think maybe the leader of the Pantheon or the Deity’s parentage, like how most of the Olympians have to seek council with Zeus the king of the Gods.
While I never had that issue with any if the three, I’d imagine that asking Thor and Tyr to speak the truth in Odin’s honor could work. However I can also see it failing as the Norse pantheon is a bit different than others in the sense that leadership is based on respect as opposed to power. Each have their own freedom to do as they please for the most part.
This is what I have come to believe, too. It was confirmed to me over time by other magicians as well as spirits. I don’t think many people are aware that what they get via these corrupted methods is something akin to a distorted mirror image of the real thing.
I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again - “magick” is just religion for most self-proclaimed magicians. Those who call themselves black magicians (not all, just the posers) just replace Jesus with Lucifer without even changing their rhetoric very much. I almost died laughing when I heard some “love thy neighbor” “Lucifer would never hurt people” preaching from a clearly super dark witch who’s totally not into those light workers. Ok
Religious people who are into magick are just as close-minded as everyone else. I won’t claim to be perfect in that regard, but at least I’m willing to try new things and be honest with myself about my experiences and what worked and what didn’t. The methods and ideas I use are not the only way, and I won’t claim that they are the best way for everyone or the only way to work successfully, but some methods and ideas are just better than others because they yield better results, but people love to get attached to their ideas, especially when given the opportunity to be a pseudo-intellectual and have people look to them as a teacher or glorious leader of some sort.
If you know anyone with real power you can’t help but be amused at these things. The only reason I’m taking the time to do this is because it amuses me and I have free time right now. Once my life gets busy again I’ll be here waaay less, but for now I may as well practice my writing and have some fun.
For the record, I think it’s largely a good thing that most aren’t playing with real powerful stuff. I’m not even sure about that to be honest, because even if they were it’s not like they could use it properly. It really doesn’t take much “juice” to entertain people and help them “win” their random inconsequential dramas. If you have the potential ability to play the real power games, you’ll find what you need.
For the record again, I’m glad that places like this exist where people can share their (to me and people like me) questionable practices with each other. Most people just want to set up their altar, leave their offerings, light some candles and pray to their favorite demon and go to their pagan festivals. I’ve been to some pagan gatherings, and as much fun as smoking some weed and playing in a naked drum duo was (it was pretty fuckin awesome tbh), that’s not what I’m looking for with my magickal practice. With magick, my concern is not community, my concern is power. If I want community, I get it from my other interests. I do this because it’s improved my writing and communication abilities immensely, and because I enjoy helping out small businesses. I also get to feel like a big-brain smarty-pants guru dude, which amuses me. Did you know that when I was five I wanted to be a priest? Well here I am, priesting it up kind of.
I think actions speaks for themselves. Sharing your daily life with spirits, and the experiences that comes with it, you will know if they’re honest towards you.
Trust and respect is not something we “take”. It’s something we earn, and if you can’t earn these basic foundations through any kind of correspondence on a daily basis, then there’s a problem.
Actually with gods I’m not so suspicious. It’s other spiritual beings who I don’t personally know that I’m Concerned with.