Beginner Questions & Experienced Member Answers Welcome Here – Getting Started

Forgot to ask this, but, if a demon doesn’t like you for some reason (or simply doesn’t want to work with you), is there a way to change their minds and see you in a favorable light?

Ok. Here’s my story. I’m a guy in my early 40s, good family, no real problems there.

I was having some problems with my job, and I stumbled onto New Avatar Power. I have always been interested in the occult, and was intrigued by a system with no tools. Long story short, I did the evocation to Elubatel for success, and she took me in quite a ride. (I don’t know why, but Elubatel seems female to me). My job fell to pieces, but I got a new better one. So success!

Here’s the thing though, even when dealing with Elubatel, I never really felt anything during the ritual. I did the relaxation and the invocation and that’s it. I didn’t experience anything mystical, but I know it worked.

I’ve had limited success with Nitika and haven’t attempted the magic mentor or attack rituals.

I’ve done a few sigils, but never with any great success. So my question here is where do I go? I want to experience something deep. I want to know power. I’m just overwhelmed


If I make a voodoo doll, is there something else I need to make it work

Yes. You have to ritually consecrate it as an effigy of your target. Otherwise, it is just a funny looking doll.

In order to feel things more, you must train your astral/magical senses.

Good systems for this would be E.A’s Ordo Ascentium Aeternalis, Konstantinos’s Summoning Spirits book, Franz Bardon’s Initiation into Hermetics book, or The Inner Temple of Witchcraft book by Christopher Penzack, just to name a few.

Maybe try those out and see if any resonate with you.

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I hope nobody minds if I activate this old threat, but I would have a question regarding alpha state. I’ve read DarkestKnight’s Tutorial for Trancework (Tutorial: Trancework - New Magician Help & Introductions - Become A Living God) and it helped me out a lot on how to do it. Yet I’m still uncertain how I can be sure I actually am in alpha state.

I daydream a lot, so maybe it should be relatively easy for me to get into alpha state but I’m not sure where to draw the line between beta and alpha state. Because during daydream I’m either only “deep in thoughts” where I can still move and consciously think, but it seems to be more like my usual state of mind when I’m awake (so probably beta). Or I’m spacing out so much my surroundings disappear and I’m fully mesmerized in the daydream which makes me unable to move.

Sorry, for the long post. I just want to know if there’s a point where I can feel that I entered alpha state. And if I just need more practice to become more aware of it, and to learn how to move in alpha state. Or if I’m going in the wrong direction right now.

Am not the person you tagged, but from personal experience you won’t get any kind of ping/mental indication that your brain has moved between different states unless you cultivate mental awareness of it*. And likely if you were try to closely check your movement from beta to alpha, you’d probably reactivate beta state by focusing too much on it.

If you’re familiar with your mindscape when you’re zoned out or daydreaming, perhaps try and put some effort into gentle recognition of that so you can direct your daydreaming or mental resources towards ritual or whatever your intended result is. Yep, classic platitude of a response here, but practice makes perfect.

Try to prime your mind for it by reminding yourself that you will gently become aware of being in alpha state every time it occurs, so you can direct your thoughts. I used a similar method to learn how to wake up without moving or opening my eyes so I could more easily have AP/OOBE/lucid dream experiences. Keep practicing and don’t get frustrated if it doesn’t work immediately; your brain is forging new neural pathways and as long as you keep focused on it, you will achieve alertness in alpha state without breaking out of alpha state.

Good luck :four_leaf_clover:


Wow, I didn’t even know this thread existed. It needs to be bumped more often.

So even though I’m not exactly new I thought of a couple questions newcomers may be afraid to ask (I think I’d have been afraid to ask even if I had known about this thread) so I’m gonna ask so they don’t have to (assuming this thread gets bumped occasionally so it is seen/found)

so without further ado…

  1. what should you do if you get interrupted in mid ritual (couple random example: thunder crashes so loud you jump or the phone rings or whatever)?

  2. if you mess up a ritual (whether you were interrupted by thunder, fell out of theta gamma or whatever) what would be the best thing to do or best way to undo it to avoid having the opposite of what you intended happen?

  3. if it seems like a spell is doing the opposite of what you intended, what should you do?

I remember being afraid of the first happening when I was newer and wondering about the second back when I was new (and I still sometimes wonder about those things occasionally) and I just thought of the 3rd question. Hope it was ok to ask here even though it’s an old thread.

I’ve had that a few times, family members waking up in the middle of the night to bother me apparently. Usually, I get like a heads up about it, and try to have everything put away, (and then I often have to do it later or something.)

The more concerning thing about that is, how the energies are effecting other people. They can get pretty intense and sometimes even throw other people off (or are their messed up energies feeding the ritual, I’m not sure.)

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Thank for replying!

It would have been too easy, after all :sweat_smile:

I think I know what you mean. Sometimes it happens when I zone out too much, that my mind “jerks” and I’m fully aware again. It’s always a shame because I never get the daydream to become as vivid as it had been before again :slightly_smiling_face:

I’m easy to doubt myself when something doesn’t seem to work, and am always torn between the questions if I’m doing it right and just need more practice for it to work, or if I’m doing it wrong and thus it doesn’t work :confused:

I will definitely continue to work on it though. Thanks again for your advice! It gave me great insight and motivated me to trust myself more :hugs:

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Meditate and get back into the right mindset.

I have no idea why you think the “opposite” of the intention would happen? Unless you intend for the opposite or piss off a spirit (which a thunder interruption probably will not achieve) having the “opposite” happen shouldn’t be in the question at all. I don’t mean to come off as rude, I just really don’t know where that idea comes from, if you didn’t understand my response, please tell me the thought behind your question so I can try again :slight_smile: .

Cleanse your energy, see where your energy is going and (re)direct it appropriately, call a spirit if you worked with them and ask for help.

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Hi, I’m new too. This is a great post for us beginners.
I would like to ask to those more experienced, What can I achieve with the occult? Can it solve all problems? Or is it more like changing oneself to better deal with them?
Can it give me a whole new perspective on life? Can it give me some insight into the nature of reality?

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What about if you sorta just snap out of the mindset you were in during your ritual? Like, when it isn’t a specific thing that’s triggered the interruption and you just sorta snap out of your trancey type state. It happened to me earlier and I was really struggling to get the connection level I’ve found I’ve been able to get in the past. I am still pretty new and doing this by feeling it out, so maybe I’m going about it entirely wrong to beging with… I do that sometimes lol

Like most things, I guess it depends what you want out of it.

Hello, it’s me again :wave:

Does someone here know what the name of the “lowest” thoughtform is?

I always was under the impression that it goes somewhat like this:

There are probably many other forms of thoughtforms missing here, but please bear with me thus I’m still learning. Somehow I got caught up in it. I know all of them are thoughtforms, but for me a servitor seems very developed already. You put much form and energy into its creation process, and I came to wonder if what lower forms of thoughtforms are called, thoughtforms that aren’t created consciously. Are they just imaginary friends or is there another word for them?

I know it’s probably a stupid question and could be solved with a little researching. I just don’t know what to look for.

I hope you can help! :slight_smile:

Unintentional thoughtforms - tend to be wispy and insubstantial. These are the kind of thoughtforms created unconsciously through emotional turmoil.

Intentional thoughtforms - these have more solid forms, and are created consciously, with an established function. These are the most basic type of servitor, and are generally dependent upon their creator to live.

Construct servitor - these are a type of created spirit that are given form and function separately from their creator. They are built up through a combination of concentration and energy work, and are not solely dependent upon their creator for the energy to live.

Independent Created Spirits- these are a type of created being that have been given a soul, usually by a demon, angel or god/goddess, elevating them above a mere servitor. Generally, this kind of spirit is indistinguishable from a “regular” spirit, and can be called upon through evocation. They have an independent existence, though may consider the magician their parent.

Egregore - these are spirits that are generally created through a group mind. Egregores tend to be created with specific niche functions. Most magical orders will create them as repositories for their knowledge, and as protectors, for example, and every member of the order will have access to it. Pop culture figures, like comic or literary characters, are another example of egregores, created by the millions of minds that interact with their media.

A godform isn’t a type of thoughtform. A godform is basically what monotheistic magicians call the “pagan” gods, because, though they are not believed to be the God, they are still considered a form of divinity.


Thank you @DarkestKnight for making the effort and explaining me this in such great detail. I’m glad to know I wasn’t completely wrong with my estimation :slight_smile:

You said godforms aren’t a kind of thoughtform, and I understand that they are considered way above a being like a servitor or egregore. But isn’t it possible to “level up” a egregore so much it would become a godform eventually? :confused:

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Not really. Some magical paradigms consider all the gods to be basically man-made egregores, but it would take a lot of energy to elevate an egregore to the status of a true godform, more than any magician or group of magicians could accomplish on their own.


Thank you for your explanation :slight_smile:

Energy work, meditation and release of built-up energy.
We are all familiar with the Psi-ball exercise, but what exactly is supposed to occur, by physical movement, in order to gerate and push and pull energy?
Middle Pillar and associated exercises are great visualizations, and yeah, you can feel the tingles, but aside from an LBRP, how is the energy sent where it is supposed to go (the target or objective)?