Are We Superior............Or Deluded?

General Discussion
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Just how far can we truly push the envelope?

Where do we draw the line?

Do you honestly think it is reasonable for magicians to think in such ‘out of this world’ concepts to continue their work beyond where it presently is?

I’ve been on this forum now for 16 months and in this time I’ve heard some pretty way-out suggestions and proposals like, I want to win the national lottery, I want to kill somebody simply because he’s making my life miserable, I want to physically shape shift into the form of a wolf, I wish to achieve immortality!! “ha…let me know if you ever achieve that last one”

Occult authors are somewhat responsible here as many imply that magic can make you literally go against physics > they sensationalise their ideas too much giving a deluded impression to the apprentice, which in my mind is simply done to sell ideas to the gullible, naïve and somewhat vulnerable to make more money?

we have to know the difference between fact and fantasy, which can be difficult as a practitioner of magician as it can create the impression that we could fly to the moon if we wanted too, or become a millionaire without lifting a finger. Do these crazy ideas truly help us spiritually rise through the trials of life, or will they just delay our progress at the end of the day?

I personally think that we as magicians have a better view of reality than the muggles, but it appears that the transition from a fresh faced beginner with almost ‘alien ideas’ into a seasoned magician with his head in reality can take years to transcend. Should it really take this long though? Could we do it far quicker or is this expecting too much?

I had some truly wacky ideas about magic when I first started simply because of all the preconditioning, it took a good few years to understand exactly what magic could do for me, and what is certainly cannot. This however doesn’t make me right in my conclusions, it just presents one personal view of life based on experiences through my own world view.

Today however, I have a well balanced view on this wonderful practice and ancient technology of the wise. I honestly can’t tell you the last time I failed and this is not to brag or gloat as I have learnt the bloody hard way. I have made every fucking mistake time and time again until it EVENTUALLY struck a chord and make me understand it better!

I never ask for things I don’t truly want, I never ask just to see if it will work as these are all ‘false-calls’ and would never work in a million years. I never try to manipulate a girl for sex or romance in general as this is another pile of bullshit put about in love spells. All you truly have to do is cast a wide net and this will bring in more opportunitys for you to choose from who are suitable.

I never chase dreams of being a lottery winner as this is a purely money related goal, which just puts you in that pool of mass intention as there’s many people all striving to attain the same goal. If I gave you a million, it wouldn’t alter your life at all until you decided to withdrawn some and buy something with it, then it would change your life as you now have a clear intention > just like if I was a bank manager and you came to me wanting money, I would want to know WHY you wanted this money…the intention is therefore the key to head towards, not the money as this is just a means to an end.

We have to understand the true reality of the situation and then apply our magic to this, or we will tend to become trapped in that realm of delusion where we try and manipulate falsities to fall into our reality instead. When I decide I want something I am prepared to do whatever it takes and this is what many beginners don’t understand. They seemed to be trapped once again in that world of fantasy thinking that because they are a magician, then they can bend physics and reality into their own warped expectations.

both life and spirit tends to reflect our internal world so when we truly want something and are prepared to reinforce this with action, then it too will be ready to act and give us ideas to use, it will guide us to opportunities and on other occasions, it will simply place it straight in our lap without any effort. So please don’t make false calls to the spirits because until you’re ready and willing, don’t expect them to be either.

The practice of magic has made me very confident, it has given me belief that is solid, it has given me a will that makes me as persistent as the terminator from those Arnie movies. These are truly great qualities to possess so magic certainly shapes the character. Magic has also matured me in many ways over the years allowing me to rise a little further towards my own God form, my own true higher self. It has shown me that I can achieve most things when I am ready, when I am willing to act for then we have power as what is power if it’s not being in a position to act, or at least willing to.

These ideas and beliefs have definitely given me a superior edge to my own character, I have brought myself out of the dungeons of doom and delusion through the practice of magic in a real way, which to me is far more potent than any hyped up sensationalistic bullshit that tends to run through the heart and soul of some magical instruction, in my opinion this type of presentation gives it a ridiculous image and a false set of expectations to the neophytes. A true magician’s mind is, ‘in my own opinion’, very much in a state of realism, not falsities and empty promises

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Immortality is the easy one. U do nothing just let your body die and then u live on. The other ones though lol yeah don’t see me turning into a tiger… Well only in bed

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Cause I gotta bounce and I cannot give a full answer:

  • We fuck up because of the increasing frequency of Dark Nights of the Soul.

  • These happen when you reach a certain point in your spiritual evolution where you abandon some points of view, etc…

  • And then we’re faced with failure and begin doubting our Art and blame it on scientific reasons, maybe think we might be schizos, etc…

SNAP OUT OF IT, CONSULT YOUR LOGS, that is why we keep written records of when shit worked and such.

  • Spirits told me we often rest on our laurels and do not push much beyond covering our necessities, this happens either because real life gets in the way and we forget to practise more oftenly outside of meeting goals, etc…

Example: Valefor said certain rituals would help in acquiring a perception of spirits much like they sell us in Hollywood, not being able to distinguish living people from spirits, etc…

It isn’t that I don’t wanna share them, it’s because it is lengthy and I have not tried them to be able to verify, but they DID involve:

  • Month of silence

  • No activity but magickal activity and sleep

  • NO FOOD FOR A MONTH (with all the medical problems it might cause) and living in miserable conditions to cause mental shifts.

Not many people would follow these instructions, don’t you think? They’d probably think if it is worth their time, if I am just exaggerating, that there must be a saner way, etc… Understandable. But in the end, as what the Left Hand Path sums up: Only what you want is what matters, pursue it fiercely even when in the face of doubt.

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Also, as an addition:

  • I do not feel superior for my involvement in the Art, but I do understand that I cannot expect understanding or acceptance from non-practitioners.

  • I do not see them as inferior, but I do see them as lazy and cowardly, though I do so with comprehension and benevolence. Took me a long time to get where I am and had to face some situations that I understand a common person would feel uneasy. I mean acceptance of some perceptions and mild experiences such as the usual poltergeits and that there are beings beyond our five main senses.

  • Through that I realized the importance of silence.

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Having a big goal gives you the self-confidence to push boundries as the magickal state exists beyond the structured reality of your mind and very existence. Also these intensrly emotional states are needed to get intona decent Trance. Whether its real or not you will figure that out naturally. Magick energetically affects the Brain, which influence Actions which bring events and your manifestation. The only thing standing between you and your goals is what goes on in Your Head and Someone Elses head and both Acting upon that. So it is reasonable to say Magick cam indeed accomplish alot of things that arr even beyond what you think is possible, considering the crazy shit people do in this world.

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I believe that whether there’s magic or not in our lives, we must take responsibilities of the choices we’ve made and not blame everyone else for all the challenges that’s blocking the progress of development.

Using baneful magic and curses because someone challenged your ego, seems a little far fetched, in my opinion. Even if it works effectively doing a death curse, what good does it bring to the magician? I’ll do understand the use of it with circumstances that requires it, like domestic violence. I hate violence and knows what damage it can do to those who experienced and witnessed it.

My own magical experiences have filled it’s purpose and I’m still harvest the positive results it has given me, and still gives me to this day. That doesn’t mean life is easier for me, but it’s been comfortable and loving in every aspect.

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All good points, so I want to play devil’s advocate for a mo here:

No-one would call a guy who wants to be a neurosurgeon, and ends up working on advanced prosthetic design “delusional” because his first goal didn’t work out, but he found a satisfactory career in a related field, would they?

Yet when someone gets into magick to, at first be able to fly or win the lottery, and ends up in a place where they can afford pretty much any first-class travel they want (and with plenty of spare cash) then were they delusional to want what they did at first? I don’t think so, as long as they get the overall goal (plenty of money, able to look down on clouds and travel freely) then they’ve done okay as far as I’m concerned.

We live in a crazy society that has issues left, right and centre over what it’s okay to ask for, to expect from life (and from yourself), and between all the competing toxic philosophies out there it’s no wonder so many normal people have to take psychiatric meds just to make it through the day - but as magicians, co-creators of our own reality, we can’t let that “Who do you think you are? Know your place and keep your head down / You not only can, but SHOULD, be perfect in every way and become a superstar” clusterfuck get to us.

I didn’t get into magick (not that it was ever a conscious choice) to be me with a bit more confidence, there are plenty of safe and accepted methods for that, I did it because I wanted to change reality as easily as I can change situations in a daydream - Stephen Flowers’ thing of making the subjective internal reality into the objective external.

True, I’ve “paid my dues” (and continue to) in terms of self-development, ruthless psychological resurfacing as and when needed, and doing tons of pathworkings, initiations, and so on, but my goals are still insanely huge, I just have a better idea what it takes to get there, and I generally don’t talk about them much in advance.

This is why this post by Josephine McCarthy on her blog is so important for newbs IMO, what looks absurd when someone has no context is less so when they have the background to bring to it.

“How do I make magick give me a new house?” is going to be taken less seriously here (and most forums) than “I got a promotion after working with King Paimon, but now I need help opening Abramelin squares to increase the annual bonus due next month” - just as an example.

Also, I look at the world around me and don’t see various selected personages flying round the sky like Aladdin on his carpet, while everyone else makes do with a bus or car, so from a very early date I knew some things were either just not possible, or more likely, would create such a fuss in the mass-observed world that they weren’t even worth pursuing.

I seriously wonder whether anyone who wants to just fly, in their normal visible body, has given any thought to how this would turn out, or ever heard of the X-Men… so, a bit of common sense, and a bit of research and observation never did anyone any harm.

Just some thoughts, when I was little I wanted to be able to make all cats able to talk, and we have lolcats now, so maybe that didn’t come off quite as planned. :slight_smile:

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Yes, this is true Biosynth and magic can push the boundaries of what is possible as it allows through sheer will, belief and energy, to make things happen that initially were deemed impossible in the past. This was the main reason why I started this thread as I wanted to poke both sides of the fence to prompt people to comment on how far we really could push the envelope before it ventures into the land of delusionary thought…

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For me, I’m just beginning to see small results. It is very hit and miss. But I’m getting here. Starting out, my expectations were way to high regarding the power of magick and demons. I had to accept that for average magicians like me, it generally just brings subtle shifts in your reality; it generally works by just pushing things in the direction that they were already going. So it will help get a girl into bed quicker if she already wants to. Someone who is repulsed by you won’t change her mind. Adept magicians may be able to pull this off, but I doubt it.

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Yes, this is true Biosynth and magic can push the boundaries of what is possible as it allows through sheer will, belief and energy, to make things happen that initially were deemed impossible in the past. This was the main reason why I started this thread as I wanted to poke both sides of the fence to prompt people to comment on how far we really could push the envelope before it ventures into the land of delusionary thought…[/quote]

Forgot to mention. There are different levels of magick and involvement. Big difference of praying over a candle and throwing around alot of silly Ritual Stuff vs… Doing things like Astral and Psychic Work. Different levels of magick.

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I don’t think we are superior, we all have struggles