It was kinda half to you half to OP. I agree we are saying the same thing. I was just kinda adding on
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Some people don’t see them as risky. They like working with humans and seem to benefit from it, making them more apt to help people. Not saying that Angels won’t, but in my opinion they are less likely to do most things demons would do. Also angels have moral limitations so to speak imo.
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That’s not true, I’ve casted successful lust spells and curses with angels, as I work exclusively with them.
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I got a chuckle out of this!
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did you evoke Haniel for the lust spell?
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No, I made an angelic egregore named Pethahiah, as I believe spirits are psychological shortcuts to the subconscious which does all the real work. And so, an entity being established or not has no changes on its efficacy.
I made a post about it and everything.
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yep…that’ll do it. Did you continue to feed her?
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No, it was a one off creation event.
This brings up some interesting ethical questions; do we have a moral responsibility to maintain the thoughtforms we create? If they have any degree of sentience they must be on some level aware of their own “dispersal” when they are not maintained. Obviously this is more the case for thoughtforms / tulkus that have been around a while and have had a chance to develop a degree of sentient existence than for a thoughtform created for a one off job.
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Since I believe all spiritual entities are just tricks of the conscious mind to access the subconscious mind, no I don’t believe they have any amount of sentience. And so, the ethics is resolved.
In a similar way that I roll my eyes when leftists say that we are harming our earth. Our earth used to be a giant ball of lava, it wasn’t until several asteroids crashed into it that it got water and some microorganisms. If all the humans and animals were to die in a nuclear war tomorrow, the earth will still continue on. We are not necessary for the health of the earth. And the heath of animals and plant life is not equivalent with the health of the earth either.
I don’t know if I’d say angels have moral limitations, but it’s been my experience most have a highly developed sense of order, very “it’s all part of the plan” type of guys and gals, i think they see themselves as behind the scenes mechanics who keep the machines running. 
The Demons i work with are more like “We’re making this shit up as we go along”…Oh and reaches over and starts hitting buttons on the angel’s console randomly. 
But don’t take my word or anyone else’s on this either, work with both and make up your own opinion on them.
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This gave me a chuckle too
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I guess I take my cue from mahayana Buddhism on this one and say that not only all thoughtforms but all phenomena are “mind only” and subject to dependent co-arising; including the human “Self”; what I am is created and recreated every day through my interactions and relations with others and therefore has an existence characterised by “emptiness” (Perhaps the emptiness of the Ain Soph to use Qabalistic terminology).
The thing is; if I am a creation of others and others are a creations of mine then that implies a co-relationship of mutual creative arising. If “reality” is interdenpendent and relational in this way, it makes sense to take an ethical repsonsibility for my creations and for them to be ethical responsible for me; the fundamental characteristic of which is compassion. If I then treat my fellow beings like this because they are, in a certain sense my creation arising out of my own mind as I arise out of theirs then surely that ethical responsibility is transferable to thoughtforms that I create out of the same “mind stuff”.
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Yep. People have this odd idea sometimes that angels will not kick the ever loving crap out of someone, lol.
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Samael? Literally the angel of death 
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Yeah, anytime people saw angels in the Old Testament the first thing the angel has to say is, “Don’t be afraid.” Because they’re intimidating.
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Indeed… A magician wrote, about advanced workings (evocations, for example) with Angels, that their light shines, but it could also blind and fulminate.
In a post I talked of spatial structures (a kind of sigils) and, a little less, of secret names… These are drawn or calculated with alphabet tables, and the theory is that an entity should answer when their structure and secret name are used. Yeah, after all, in some cases Angels may help with things deemed unorthodox for them.
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Hmm, so those people in the Bible were afraid of their own subconscious minds then? Interesting. Why would the angels appear as scary to them if they were imagining an angel instead of a demon?
I’d imagine their subconscious would have made the angel the good guy? Maybe I don’t get it.
Ancient Jews didn’t have as sanitized a version of God that we do. In Genesis 32:30, So Jacob named the place Peniel, for he said, “I have seen God face to face, yet my life has been preserved.”
He is surprised that after seeing an eloheim he is still alive, and this is the general sentiment. Gods usually only appear to fix a problem, and so these people are afraid that the eloheim is there to judge them and kill them, same thing with the angels. These are the messengers of their gods, and if you offend the messenger of a king and he declares war on you, how much more serious are the crimes of offending the messenger of a god.
So, it has to do with the cultural milieu of the time, as the subconscious mind has certain paradigms that it gets stuck in. It’s the purpose of ritual to change these subconscious paradigms to fit with the will and desire of the magician.
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Awesome, thanks for answering 
.
Yes, I’m going to explore and try. I don’t have magickal tools but
I’m going to try evocation with sigils. I saw the words “Camael” multiple times this past week
so I’m going to try to evoke the angel Camael.
Then depending on the results I may move on to try the goetia.
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