The Dissatisfaction of Baneful Works


#1

Most say that we don’t want to alert the target of our baneful work.
But how much satisfaction can there be in a work of vengeance which is accomplished without the target aware that you have made him fall?


#2

There’s been people who poisoned people with slow acting poison. their target died a slow and painful end, but was unaware of what or who was responsible… do you think the poisoner had some satisfaction with the result?


#3

If you do magic so that you can rub it in some guys face your doing it wrong.


#4

I’ve meditated a lot on this question myself and these are the answers I’ve come up with. An act of baneful magick is purely for the destruction and/or removal of the intended victim from the magicians life. Having them know it was you is merely a satisfaction of the ego and ultimately does nothing for you. But as for the downsides of letting them know you are working against them not only does it make you look childish but it also presents them with the opportunity to defend themselves. In my opinion when you make a victim aware of your actions you are setting yourself up for a failure and the show of bravado that comes with telling them gives way to the possibility that their demise was not your intention to begin with but merely making a threat to feel dominant over said person.


#5

Well there was one time I bullshitted this one guy who was kind of an idiot and told him I was going to use magic on him. I didn’t and the stuff I said would happen, happened anyway, kinda funny how things work out sometimes.


#6

What’d you tell him? Sometimes people do that shit to themselves through building up negativity. It’s completely possible your words just provided a conduit for that negativity to channel itself and multiply through the guy thinking he was actually cursed.


#7

Well basically this guy kept on crying about how he got banned from a forum a year ago. I told him that if he kept whining at me I would do magic that would make him get banned from all the forums he goes to on the internet and thats pretty much what ended up happening to him.


#8

Yeah, sounds like a self fulfilling prophecy to me dude. He probably just wanted to blame your threat on his own shortcomings as a person.


#9

“Removal” is not the only purpose of baneful magic.
Revenge is completely different.
The target may have removed itself from your life years ago.


#10

Not making a target aware of a working is only one perspective some use. There are a few main reasons as to why. Then there are workings that use the awareness of the target to create a sympathetic conexion. It’s likely to be annoying to the sorcerer cus they will hear how it’s not working or they are not afraid bla bla. But… If the link is established then its another in. Plus mind fucks can be amusing and worth putting out there in there own right.


#11

I suppose it depends on the person, if its someone like the indevidual I mentioned it would be the way to go as I didn’t even need to do anything. If its someone on this forum for example I would say its better to go silent.


#12

I agree it depends on the goal mainly and person a bit as well. A lot can be done with a lil chaos. }:slight_smile:


#13

If I’m aiming to do serious damage then I will keep it a secret. As UndeadGod elaborated a nice mind fuck can be just as bad plus it also gives one the advantage of distraction. They think A is being attacked while you work on B.


#14

To further on what Katari wrote and specifically Student of Goetia’s comment- I’d say there are two broad categories of “unfavorable influence”- Binding another/ensnaring/obstructing/‘evil-eye’ (perhaps called above ‘revenge’), vs a curse in Baneful Works (which I believe means smiting fully)… being very different. (in tone and feel sending, as well as in affect)

Like sending Gatekeeper B. or D King Paimon to “pressure someone” to act in a certain way, vs to “intimidate” vs to send nightmares and aches/pain
all of those seem to be what I think is the first category, while the second category is what I think EA meant Baneful Works to be solely about…

EA mentions in interviews (and in the About Complete Works video) that he started out thinking there is no book/info avail about the Darkest aspect… killing with Magick, and that was what he wanted to focus on (while there could be seen to be books/info about ‘revenge’)
and one could seek to Baneful Curse another to their demise… and end up “only” causing their situation to crumble… bad luck and such… (while usually the revenge doesn’t end up killing(?))

Thus compare the last few chapters of Baneful Works to the BALG Newsletter/YouTubeVideo about the ChickenFeet binding (which I’d say could be what you are looking for?) --although it could be EA’s thoughts about cursing might have shifted in the time since BW was written.

dunno. the last part was just some thoughts I had as I wrote this, but the first part (from my exper of Contacting Entities)- I definitely distinguish between the Presence-Feeling of 2 types of dark forces… Those I’d classify as first type (revenge) seem to have a very different feel from the Second type…

====
ie
Don’t send an assassin to harass and Send A Msg… nor send a “thug” or ShadowNightmare that Intimidates (ie Social-comm) to do direct-action.


But recently I’ve seen more of the “layer behind” referred to by Gatekeeper A (in BoA) about the Infernal Citadel and seeing the continuing action of the “Hierarchy” seen as acting against/contrary … but from the perspective of the “timeless” and BigPicture that is actually the counter-current to keep Existence existing… (as without that “Infernal Against” all would flow back in- and thus all would cease… [Tome p711 and ref p712]

seeing the current as a flow, is merely seeing a single Dynamic “Balancing of Forces” (inside and outside the bubble) which is just alllatonce from the perspective outside time… vs only Seeing it in Motion “within time” [Tome p709 top of page]

       _____________________________

Unbound- stand alone before ____ and… “Now we may begin.”

(“Devotion and discipline /discipleship had only been the primer for understanding that which would come.” a preparation to start, not the end (the Way goes on) [Tome p799]


#15

[quote=“Student of Goetia, post:9, topic:1411”]“Removal” is not the only purpose of baneful magic.
Revenge is completely different.
The target may have removed itself from your life years ago.[/quote]

Just because a target has moved doesn’t mean that they are removed from your life. The damage they caused be it emotional, psychological or physical can last long after they’ve left your area.

By exacting revenge one is still removing or at least attempting to repair the damage done and empower themselves. By killing/torturing their target either realistically or symbolically through ritual they are taking back control and righting whatever wrong was committed against them however valid or petty it may be.


#16

[quote=“Student of Goetia, post:1, topic:1411”]Most say that we don’t want to alert the target of our baneful work.
But how much satisfaction can there be in a work of vengeance which is accomplished without the target aware that you have made him fall?[/quote]

That would properly be “revenge”. Vengeance, on the other hand, is not about satisfaction of some lower desire but about justice. You do it for the same reason that you give your life to save a certain person even if that person were never to know about it, or worse, think the worse of you for it. It’s just a matter of principle. It comes from a higher world, not this one.


#17

[quote=“Poete Maudit, post:16, topic:1411”][quote=“Student of Goetia, post:1, topic:1411”]Most say that we don’t want to alert the target of our baneful work.
But how much satisfaction can there be in a work of vengeance which is accomplished without the target aware that you have made him fall?[/quote]

That would properly be “revenge”. Vengeance, on the other hand, is not about satisfaction of some lower desire but about justice. You do it for the same reason that you give your life to save a certain person even if that person were never to know about it, or worse, think the worse of you for it. It’s just a matter of principle. It comes from a higher world, not this one.[/quote]

You don’t really get revenge if the person doesn’t know that it’s you doing it.
An interest in revenge usually has nothing to do with justice.
as you say, justice needs a third party to judge.
Are you saying a higher world is interfering with the will of a black magician,
in the interest of justice?
whose justice?


#18
You don't really get revenge if the person doesn't know that it's you doing it. An interest in revenge usually has nothing to do with justice. as you say, justice needs a third party to judge. Are you saying a higher world is interfering with the will of a black magician, in the interest of justice?

Huh? Why is there no revenge if the target is unaware it was you? As long as I know they suffered at my hand that is plenty. What your after is some satisfaction to your ego where your target balls his fists in flacid fury and says “You win this time, but this is far from over!!!” Get yourself a nemesis if that’s what your after, you two can play the game of one upping each other.

Revenge is completely about justice, if your wronged in some perceived way you feel the JUSTIFICATION to retaliate or get revenge. When you decide to curse you are judge, jury and executioner if that’s the level you want to take it to.

Justice and revenge are simply convienient concepts we use as an excuse to act. They simply serve to protect the ego when our desires are not socially acceptable, its ok to retaliate but mot to strike first…bullshit its all the same. Do what you want, there is no one to answer to except the consequences of your own actions.


#19

With all those thoughts a Third world war might be on the next corner…thats what i think.


#20

What’s more important it’s the outcome, if he’s a nuisance to your life and yours, wha’ts important is he’s finished, at least for me