Subconscious mind or magick?

[Eddie_Romanov]

I hereby invoke the sacred formula of POR QUE NO LOS DOS?

[Gwydion22]

@Ancestor

Yeah, based on the model you described, you’d likely be drawing an elemental, or some other kind of spirit. A representative of the spirit you intended to call. And this is quite common.

Wait! Is this really true? Like most of the people here on Balg are practising this system. Does that mean we are calling someone else (imposter/representative) and not the actual being we are intending to call forth.

@Ancestor

If you mean to say that all spirit work is effective only in trance, I think there is some misunderstanding.
I agree you need to be in a trance like state to begin such work involving communication. But I don’t believe that if your trance is disrupted that is the end of the work and any success is limited because of that break in trance. There are many, including myself, that once they have seen spirit, the sheer surprise breaks your trance, but does not break the experience.
Instead you have a very lucid clarity – fully awaken but a kind of transcendental perception.
I also would like to suggest, there are many that don’t require trance to be able to have some brief communication with spirit. They usually have very strong psychic and intuitive capabilities.

I have a question related to this. It is quite a bit off topic but I had a experience with Lucifer and he talked to me through ‘telepathy’. As you said it is also a one form of communication with the spirit. I also saw him with my minds eye. Now, what confuses me is was that really lucifer? I confirmed with my friend who was very closed to him ask this question and he replied that ‘it was him.
Now, the question is I wasn’t in trance nor I was trying to evoke him but is it possible that spirits can communicate to you without being in trance and come whenever they want without summoning? Or this is just my mind tricking me ? Because it’s been 3 times Lucifer has visited me.

@Ancestor

If you’re operating from their framework of what magic is and how it works you need to appreciate your understanding will be limited to their framework. Beyond that scope there are alternative explanations.

I doubted my magic becomes sometimes spirits come and they say they will help but they don’t. What can you do?
Or they come and they help after a really long time – at a time when you thought they weren’t going to. And at that time they help you.

I get it. You’re tryna say to explore other forms of magick ? Since I’ve started on this journey I’ve only read EA KOETTING’s books and Gallery of magick. What do you think is the best forms of magick? I’ve read some of Solomonic magick but it seemed a bit complicated for me.

@Ancestor

You are right. And I agree. The mind doesn’t matter.
The proponents of these principles of psychological magic don’t accept the idea of spirit doing the work though – because remember it’s all in their mind. So the success/failure is dependent on their mindset.

Okay! Now I get it. It’s a relief to hear this. Because I’ve read many times that magick doesn’t work if you keep wandering your mind upon your desired will. Because yes! That happens many times, no one can totally get there minds off from a thing they desire. And if the magick doesn’t work? They say it’s because ‘lust for results’ etc.

Your answers were brilliant. And Thankyou so much for putting an effort to provide knowledge.

[Gwydion22]

Do you recommend sticking with one or mixing the two’s?

[Dinmiatus]

I can only speak to my own experiences on that. To do otherwise would be limiting and presumptuous.

My own views are a blending of both and seeing both as correct from a holographic stand point. Not as a either it is this or that perspective.

For example some see servator creation as a production purely of the mind, a type of self generated compartmentalization to work with an isolated aspect of self. While the spiritual perspective would imply it is the formation of new spiritual entity through the application of will. I see it as both at the same time, both a production of the mind and the creation of life.

As will the hermetic stand point “All is in the mind of the all” in my own views on this maxims as a result of my own experiences “The All” is seen as a blending of universal mind and the will of the soul flowing in my life.

I do not mean this in any religious way simply from a point of personal perspective. Since that is the only perspective i can observe this play out at.

[Gwydion22]

If magick is real then I agree with you, subconscious and magick can do wonders together.

[Ancestor]

@Gwydion22

Wait! Is this really true? Like most of the people here on Balg are practising this system. Does that mean we are calling someone else (imposter/representative) and not the actual being we are intending to call forth.

PM me, let’s talk about this outside of this thread otherwise it’ll get too long.