Paimon - two in one?

Hello to everyone and homage to the Great King Paimon!

First a short story:
I had some successes with Paimon. The last time I worked with him was for my girlfriend who needed help to influence the mind of her manager for job issues.
So I called Paimon (sigil gazing with name repetition) offering incense and I asked to influence the mind of the boss. I told my girlfriend to burn some incense and a little bit of her hair as an offering to the King. She did and the results were great.
My girlfriend doesn’t pratic magick, it was me doing the operation she only paid an offering but I think this was very important.

Now the issue:
my girlfriend needs the work of Paimon again and this time also I need (job stuff again).
So I was thinking about calling Paimon only once and ask contemporaneously to do the work for me and for her. We want to make one offering together (mix of our hair for example, plus incense).
My thought is this way we can create an amplification effect and have better results than doing two separate operation.

What do you think about this idea? Did anyone do a similar thing?

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King Paimon’s ruling planet is Mercury. Placing blood on the sigil will give it life. When evoking him, do so on the day and hour of mercury. This is Wednesday right at the break of sunrise. I use a flour circle, with black candles on all cardinal points. (The points of the Pentagram) ,

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Sorry … what?

If I recall correctly, he’s a king, therefore Sun would be his planet.

Ask Paimon if he’s okay with it. It’s him that you’re dealing with, not us.

I pulled that from here.

http://www.angelfire.com/empire/serpentis666/DEMONVII.html

[quote=“Euoi, post:4, topic:3544”]If I recall correctly, he’s a king, therefore Sun would be his planet.

Ask Paimon if he’s okay with it. It’s him that you’re dealing with, not us.[/quote]

That site isn’t very reliable.

So can you direct me to information that is…?

I stand corrected. I just found the information under “observations” in the Goetia.

I wouldn’t call the Ars Goetia very reliable either. It’s certainly wrong to class Paimon in the same category as the other 8 kings.

Well, since you’re a much better magician than Alister Crowley, what should we trust, Oh great one?

Damn, someone beat me to the sarcastic retort.

If we’re going to play superior and boast of a so much more infallible source of knowledge that renders us oh-so-high, is it too much to ask of an adult with intellectual integrity to provide something constructive? You don’t even have to master your own ego yet, as long as it’s useful. Goddamn.

Sorry that took more space than the part having to do with the OP. There is a certain entity that I converse with at least once a day, he’s kind of ‘mentoring’ me in magick as well as general attitudes toward life. So a lot of these communications will address multiple things, this entity has many others under him so often the multiple tasks will be issued almost like from a meeting on ‘battle plans’.

King Paimon is certainly of that spiritual rank, and then some: no telling how many legions he has under him (figure of speech, I know there are numbers attributed but let’s ease off the pedantry until it becomes -useful-?). The main thing it depends on is: your relationship with him. That’s what’s important. Just some things to consider, with that in mind I’m sure you’ll achieve what you’re working for.

Sorry to everyone for the momentary unpleasantness, I seem to have had it up to here with superiority shows that don’t throw down with anything more beneficial than ‘I am so much better than you!’ and I’ve gone and lost all my Southern manners. I’ll be drinking mint juleps until I’m fit for civilized conversation again.

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I’m not sure why you reference Crowley, as he didn’t author the Ars Goetia. Be that as it may, Crowley is probably … scratch that … without a doubt the most ridiculously overrated magician of all time. What did he actually accomplish, again? You know, besides dying hated and alone in poverty? Specifically, what did he ever accomplish with the spirits of the Goetia? Yes, I am a better magician than Crowley. That isn’t itself much of an accomplishment.

The fact of the matter is that the Ars Goetia is from its source texts provably full of errors, and I have already demonstrated this here before.

[quote=“Claidheam, post:11, topic:3544”]Damn, someone beat me to the sarcastic retort.

If we’re going to play superior and boast of a so much more infallible source of knowledge that renders us oh-so-high, is it too much to ask of an adult with intellectual integrity to provide something constructive? You don’t even have to master your own ego yet, as long as it’s useful. Goddamn.[/quote]

Thanks for the straw man. Pointing out demonstrable error in the text which are being perpetuated without thought or knowledge is intellectually constructive.

Paimon is, in the source tradition of the Ars Goetia, one of the kings of the cardinal points. The Goetia fudges this fact. That places him, along with Amaymon, in a distinct order above that of the other kings in the text. Specifically, the other kings are subordinates of the Four Kings, Paimon’s being namely Belial and Balam. Now I’ll leave it up to you to figure out why the attribution of gold to all of them is spurious, and the associations of metals made even more spurious by the fact that there is little consistency between attributions of rank amongst the various texts deriving from the fabled Liber Occifiorum.

What? I have offered beneficial insights time and again on these forums, and given private advice to a dozen members who have solved their problems thanks to it. It never ceases to amaze me how those complaining of ‘arrogance’ are so often the very ones showing it.

Poete, the only thing you’ve done on this thread is offer dead-end replies, steer the conversation round to how you’re better than everyone else - including the authors of the Goetia and Crowley - and namedrop a book which can’t be used as a reference because the original seems to have been lost forever. Please, let’s try and stay on topic.

If you have a post where you feel you already covered this, perhaps you could link to it? If you think you made a useful post about something that keeps coming up, you can always use the Bookmark Topic function to make it easy to find again.

Back to business:

I’ve personally soul-travelled to entities and also performed evocations, including of demons, for myself and for another person at the same session.

It didn’t seem to amplify the result but it didn’t harm it either, and I’m not aware of any rules that say you can only take one intention into these kinds of operations.

It’s usually best to make sure you have no nagging subconscious doubts about the other person’s requests, either because you disapprove or because you don’t actually believe it’s possible, and if you can rule those out you should be fine - good luck and please let us know how it goes.

May I ask how demonstrating a point of contention in the Ars Goetia is a “dead-end reply”? I am trying to employ Socratic dialectic here to get people to think, but apparently that last bit is just not happening.

[quote]steer the conversation round to how you’re better than everyone else -[/quote

No such claim has been made by me. But apparently nobody else here has even a rudimentary understanding of where the Ars Goetia originated.

including the authors of the Goetia

No such claim has been made by me. I have stated here and before that the author of the Ars Goetia produced a work riddled with errors, and this claim is demonstrably true to any thinking person who is willing to invest just a little bit of time in researching the textual history of the work.

and Crowley -

Yes. Crowley was an inept child-molesting charlatan for the most part, who is only so revered because of his knack for showmanship and flashy writing.

and namedrop a book which can't be used as a reference because the original seems to have been lost forever.

Actually, there exist several derivatives in various languages of the work other than Weyer’s Pseudomonarchia - the primary source of the Ars Goetia - which are far more complete and allow us check the omissions and veracity of the latter - and later - text.

Perhaps the place for that’s on a new thread, since it’s totally off-topic to what was asked here.

Gobsmacked Socrates used to go round saying “Sorry … what?” - I guess those Bill & Ted movies were more accurate than I thought! :wink:

Have you ever performed an evocation, spellwork, anything, that combined two people’s work in one operation?

Are you aware of any cautions against it, either given to you personally, or in any of your reading?

After posting my last reply, I realised that I’ve found it’s better to address your own request to the spirit first as that’s usually the most pressing concern in your own mind, and there’s a degree of artifice, however unintentional, in asking for something else first.

Probably doesn’t apply in every case, but that’s something from my own notes anyway.

Never approach a spirit in one ritual with more than one purpose. One has to be single-minded in this. Successful magical creation leaves no room for half-baked and ill-formed ideas. These just float about on the astral like misshapen cast-offs of a crazed mind, with little chance of ever coming into physical reality.

Probably the best advice in this thread.

When I do a ritual and get the ‘bright idea’ to request more than one thing, it generally ends in failure.

Those that I perform with a mindset on one very specific task to accomplish, it ends in success.

Probably the best advice in this thread.

When I do a ritual and get the ‘bright idea’ to request more than one thing, it generally ends in failure.

Those that I perform with a mindset on one very specific task to accomplish, it ends in success.[/quote]

Perhaps Poet should be a little more eloquent in his responses. Then, he might actually have people listen to him.