Note: I recognize that there are plenty of other factors at play in people’s moral thinking. These are just the ones I brought up.
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I’m going to have to disagree cuz if this was true I wouldn’t have to hear the phrase " cultural relativism" all the time and I wouldn’t have gotten into an argument with some Saudi Arabian international students at my college about whether or not it’s ok for them to kill their sisters if they get raped. We would think if the laws of right and wrong are imprinted in us then all of these men would have known that killing a woman as punishment for her being raped is wrong, yet they all said that it’s exactly what they would do. And I think it’s fucked up. But maybe I’m just narrow minded and can’t get passed my ethnocentric bias to see the beauty of honor killings . 
What a wicked intolerant white demoness am I.
Sorry…I’ll quit ranting.
@succupedia my disagreement is still in total respect for you and your opinions. I may get snarky sometimes in my expression but I hold you in high regard and never mean any offense 
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It’s totally ok to not agree with one another, and I’m not that easily offended.
Allthough the lack of moral and ethics in cultures that instigates “honor killing”, doesn’t mean they’re without moral and ethics of their own failings. Flip the coin, and I’m sure they have moral and ethical reasons to not getting punished for what they did, or didn’t do “wrong”.
And women in these particular areas - Middle East and India - has lately taken the justice in their own hands, doing beheadings and genitial mutilations of their perpetrators. I would not be surprised if big changes are heading their way in 15-20 years from now.
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I hope things do change.
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To me, morals are training wheels for conducting your actions, both mundane and magical. But after a certain point they are worthless.
That is the point where you base your actions on pure cold unfeeling intellect. Meaning you act based on how much power you have, How much of any resource you have, Whether you have the physical strength to do such and such, Or whether you know the skills or knowledge necessary to acomplish your goals.
So for example:
The Moral Aspect of Family is bullshit to me. There is no Family. Its a group of humans fighting to survive that are leeching off each other for mutual benefit.
They are the WORST quality food. Ever.
I prefer to not be leeched off of 
For friendship: Honor/respect and such shit
Love: A pact of Survival/Ascent through means of emotional bonding. Taking into account emotional energy, power level, EMOTIONAL RECIPROCITY, etc. Until of course, they start interfering with my goals/Ascent or start bringing up bullshit. Repeated interference or bullshit reduces nullifies the pact and reduces the offended party down to mere survival. Then they become food.
Magic:
No morals neccesary. Just Intelligent Decisions.
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I remember a video that EA made that essentially connects morality in Magick to maturity.
He described a phase he went through where he was Cursing people left and right simply because he could but as he got older and progressed in his Ascent he grew out of it. Not that he suddenly had issues with cursing, but I’m saying that if one adheres to an objective morality that says harming people for minor offenses is wrong, then what he expressed can be described as acting more morally with his Magick as he matured in personality.
And to be honest I do see being all " Death to anything and everything I see fit!!!" As being immature. It’s like when you’re in high school all upset about some drama and maybe even get into a physical confrontation family is telling you that when you get older stuff like that won’t even be worth your time. Higher maturity= this person isn’t worth the trouble of punching in the face. Magickaly speaking: not worth my candle.
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This fits nicely with Magick I think. You don’t Curse me, I don’t Curse you, let’s help each other out as a community.
I see what you mean, but im not necessarily talking about cursing left and right for small stuff
Im talking more repeated, cyclical type shit. People repeating the same actions, habits, behaviors, that keep affecting you in any way regardless of family, friends, or relationship (human or Divine).
One can handle the small stuff, but its when that small stuff starts to build and amount to bigger and bigger agitation/annoyance that action has to be taken, to me
I wasn’t talking to you directly.
But yes. Repeated offenses by one person is an issue of drawing boundaries. Otherwise you are letting yourself get walked all over like a welcome matt.
And for myself: there are several methods of taking care of such things that I can choose from based on the gravity of the offense.
Morality is messy messy messy.
But I think these are good conversations to have. It’s nice to see where others stand.
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In the words of one famous (if fictional) black Mage: “there is no good and evil, there is only power and those too weak to seek it.”
Then again, those who argue that there’s no good and evil usually tend to be classified as “evil” by the rest of us. 
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That whole argument automatically assumes that a person who has power above what society would normally permit will act in ways that harm others, though. 
I would substitute that with this: the person will do what they think will fulfil them, and that this won’t automatically mean a net harm, or a long-term harm, to anyone else - a classic example would be having total power and going back in time to kill Pol Pot, for example.
Mostly in life I think we just want what we want, and we look for fancy philosophies to tart that up, this is why I abandoned study of them! 
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Well thank you 
Nah, no good, no evil as those are human terms based solely on perspective.
My “morals” and “ethics” are purely this:
Respect
Even if its the shared respect of staying out of one another’s way, its still Respect, and with respect comes a host of things I value over everything.
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That actually kinda proves my point above, you seldom see anyone who is universally considered to be “good” pushing that line. 
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Well why on the gods’ green planes would they? they haven’t accepted both sides of the coin, and aren’t willing to become the “bad guy” if the need ever arose.
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This is correct they are just a construct, I go from the heart, if I love you Then I love you and am good to you because you are good to me but when people fuck with me or my family I take care of it with not equal but much more force.
This is where the law of three comes into play. Not the Wicca law of the return of three but my law of I return in threes. Be good to me you will get it back x3 fuck with me and mine and you get fucked back 3x as hard. Not to mention when they fuck with us they are fucking with all nine of us and not just one person we are one in nine and nine in one. 
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While you may be banned, allow me to add salt to the wound, especially since you’re my stalker by saying, you’re are utterly incorrect.
I agree with Velotak, as usual 
.
In all seriousness, morals are limiting. Why constrain what and why you do something? This is supposed to be the year you lot break your limits come on…
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So basically are you saying that your basic ethic is to nurture life and not just human life?
I went back into the archives and found this thread. I probably should have done an archives search before I started a new thread.
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The Black Path ironically entails an ethos just as the Sacred Red Road does: Spurning altruism,and restraint, for example, become necessities.
How about this viewpoint:
given action is good for one being, bad for another:
Food consumption.
To be exact, Meat.
Steak for example.
Have to be a living creature and then is killed and eaten by us.
Bad for the Cow. Very bad.
Good for us, becouse it keeps us nutrated.
Hmm…
A Lion eat’s a Human -Bad for the Human.
Now…
Of course these are theoretical.
But the point is, once you learn to leave your own viewpoint, and go into that of who ever is in front of you, you’ll learn to adjust to any situation. 
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But do we, really, leave our own viewpoints and tackle our daily lives indifferently? What would your thoughts be, just by simply taking a stroll in the city with visual impressions of people passing by, or of something happening in your surroundings? If you just shrug your shoulders, thinking you don’t really care, it’s still a statement of your own point of view.
We always have impressions to deal with every single day. And we deal with these impressions by our own point of view.
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