Lucifer, Ahriman, and Anthroposophy

Black Magick & The Left Hand Path
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Who here is familiar with the work of Rudolph Steiner and his teachings on Lucifer and Ahriman? I’ve been listening to some of his lectures and his views are certainly interesting. They certainly make me very hesitant to engage in working with Ahrimanic energies, and also a little bit hesitant around working further with Lucifer. I have done some work with Lucifer in the past but not with Ahriman.

Basically Steiner believes that Lucifer and Christ both incarnated on this planet in the past at various points in time and contributed in different ways to the awakening and evolution of human consciousness. Whilst neither Lucifer or Ahriman are seen as forces of “good” for mankind it would seem that Lucifer at least contributed somewhat to the enlightenment of man. Ahriman on the other hand is (based on Steiner’s estimate) due to incarnate within our current age and will be the absolute embodiment of scientific rationalism and the worship of science and materialism over spirit. According to Steiner Ahriman and the Ahrimanic current seeks to cut people off from their connection with spirit and source energy and redirect it into a completely mental sphere eg. The 8th Sphere. One can already see this shaping up in some ways through the rise of AI, transhumanism, and the collective consciousness spending more and more time disembodied within the digital landscape. Essentially the point is that both Lucifer and Ahriman are able to enhance the individual consciousness in different ways but neither have altruistic motivations and seek to disembody man from anchoring unconditional love and christ consciousness on this planet. I almost see it as a siphoning where one believes that they are gaining great power (they may well be) but that power is not primarily directed to the greater good. It could also be described as “ME” vs “US” and the belief in oneself as the greatest “GOD” rather than “GOD” being something greater than all of us.

Interested to hear some thoughts and discussion from others familiar with Anthroposophy and how they feel about the relevance of these teachings in our current climate.

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I’m familiar with some of material. His writing style is opaque and more popular in new age circles, and very rarely talked about here.

I agree with some parts and not with others. In this case, his opinion, imo, is assumptive and based on a xtian church controlled, very narrow understanding of either Lucifer or Ahriman that ignores any view not in line with his bias.

Lucifer, as far as I can tell based on my research and personal experience with both, is not related to Ahriman. It’s really like Steiner is talking about different concepts that happen to have the same name.

The funny part about this, is science has become a primitive atheistic religion, rejecting topic for research on emotional grounds only, and people that try to explore consciousness and spirit are ostracized, and occasionally destroyed. An awakening is very obviously happening. This… prophecy… is not being proven correct. It may have been fear based. He knew some things, but what he thought he knew all about, wasn’t the whole story.

This shows a complete misunderstanding of what these entities can do and what christ consciousness even is. Only a human can enhance it’s own consciousness. Christ consciousness, imo, IS US. Jesus = Isus = IS US. It’s the collective unconscious of humanity. We can’t be disconnected, and won’t be until there is no such thing as a human in existence.

I think you want to get out of fear and dualistic judgement. Duality is a fake control mechanism. Nobody is “gaining great power”, we are remembering who we are, and that we all already have great power, and how to respect it and use it. And so do you :slight_smile:

UPG is UPG, he’s entitled to his opinion as am I, as are we all, as immortal spirtual beings with free will. At the end of the day, your truth is found within. Steiner would be the first person to tell you to think for yourself.

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Following.

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Thank you for your thoughtful response. Reflecting on what you’ve written I do recognise an aspect of my fear based dualistic thinking when it comes Lucifer in particular. I’ve already had some very interesting and powerful experiences with Lucifer’s current and feel very drawn to working with it further, however Steiner’s teachings have certainly made me more hesitant and cautious towards deepening this relationship, whether that is a good thing or not. I’m reminded once again how easy it is to get influenced by others teachings and beliefs rather than ones own experience. The duality of good and evil certainly continues to have a strong foothold in my unconscious influences moving forward.

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Well actually you can’t really compare them cause are totally different worlds. Ahriman is Magic, Chaos and Darkness. But work a little more with the demonic rather than to jump blind in Ahriman’s energy

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First off we must adress the usage of Lucifer and Ahriman as part of the same pantheon.
What Steiner writes about is HIS understanding of the two enteties, they do not align with the same enteties in other traditions. For example the Lucifer I have worked with (or rather Lucifer-Satan) is a destructive and enligthend entity that seeks to destroy the creation, other people who work with Lucifer experience him in other ways.
The same goes with Ahriman.

The thing is that Steiners view that science is some sort of opposistion towards something cold and sterile and that we should move away from science to understand our spiritual nature isn’t true.
I currently study computer science (or to be more precise informatics) and things have actully moved away more and more from the cold and sterile ideas that didn’t take humanity and human behavior into account and now strives to understand how people and organisations function and think wich actully has provided me with tools to futher examine myself.

@Mulberry If I dont remember wrong Steiner had a background in theosophy and I think it was that that influenced him more then judeo-christian culture.

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Yeah I don’t remember either. He was a prolific writer, and I was more interested in his work with educational development in Waldorf schools and bees.

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To be honest I have always had a bit of problems with Waldorf for some reason becuse it can go so wrong unless you atleast have a structure. And no its not just something teoretical as history has shown. We had a big case here in just last year where former students at a waldorf school had sufferd highly becuse of it under the guidence of Pär Ahlbom.

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Yes the structure is part of it and can’t be separated, it’s considered important for education to help learners feel safe and learn boundaries within a clearly understood structure. The parents are encouraged to be highly involved, especially at early learning levels, and learn about Steiner’s philosophy of Anthroposophy and read his writings so they also understand and are on board. For preschool, this means the parents attend every class as well, it’s not a daycare, and the parents slowly attend less until middle school age. Waldorf fits well with attachment parenting. There’s a specific textbook that explains things from why the classrooms are painted specific colors for each grade to the spiritual aspects of completing an incarnation through the early years.

But it’s done differently in the US and is a private school thing for holistic parents, but in Germany it’s been dumbed down to just remedial education, or so my German fields told me many years ago.