Ah. Mystery solved then.
The Elohim are all sons of El (or An in the Sumerian pantheon), this includes the fallen ones, or watchers. The only difference between them is in their allegiances, the watchers are bacially rebel gods / angels.
BTW, I agree that you should forget about Goetic demons and concentrate on working with the Elohim, that should work much better for you.
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Ah! Relativism. I fought against in undergrad, graduate school and I guess, now, here. If you lay on train tracks and a train goes over you, without getting into the metaphysical part, you won’t be “relatively dead”. You will be dead, dead. I find it interesting the complete departure from orthodoxy and when people here say, “X deity in the grimoire was Y deity in the Vedic tradition and Z deity in the Nordic pantheon.” Again, allow me to phrase it correctly; least I come into trouble by the censor police. I’m not claiming supremacy, but I can tell you unequivocally, unmistakably, since I serve Elohim that there’s no other entity in some other pantheon that IS Elohim. Elohim is Shaddai. Jehovah or more respectfully, HaShem. H- is not any other G-d in any other pantheon. To suggest otherwise is preposterous and the purposeful creation of a false narrative. Of course, as you might imagine, in my own personal belief (without claiming supremacy), there’s only one G-d. Because I hold this belief, this does not preclude me from communing with those who are politheistic or who hold different beliefs than mine. I have many politheistic friends and I don’t need to bring down someone’s personal religious predilections to make me feel good about my own. Just saying.
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@Edwin_Odesseiron Once again, relativism creeps in. In my personal belief (do not claim supremacy), demons are demons and angels are angels. There are instances where demons have, for lack of a better word, fooled some by appearing to them
as angels. Again, just like angels, demons are supernatural creatures that used to be angels. In my personal opinion, any given demon can take the of anything really—including an angel. I saw your PM. Thank you.
You need to study the Sumerian originals of these Bible stories to appreciate where they come from. Monotheism is a relatively recent development in human history and in my view, clearly erroneous, at least up to a degree. There is one God, but they are also many. A contradiction it seems, but not so much once you understand non-duality. The Elohim are a collective, the collective mind of Heaven so to speak. There are many of, and in Heaven, but they share one mind.
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I’ve studied the Sumerian tradition in undergrad. Your point about monotheism is your opinion. Again, I go back to my original point, I don’t need to knock politheism as a practitioner of monotheism to feel good about being a practitioner of monotheism. I respect your opinion and certainly, you’re entitled to your opinion just as I am to mine when it comes to the G-d I serve.
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Actually, Catholicism makes a similar point about the trinity, with one God who exists in three persons. The Hindu concept of Trimurta is also of a similar vein. But this isn’t a religious debate, I guess we’ve solved the mystery of why Goetic demons and other deities will not come to you when invoked. You are excluding them from your reality and are refusing to accept them as they are. Their very existence clashes with the world view and religious beliefs you were brought up with. You would need to undergo a thorough self-de-brainwashing to make any progress on the LHP or any other form of polytheism or Shamanism. For now, you should just probably stick to RHP traditions.
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I 100% agree. Although there is this one entity that for some reason I feel drawn to and it’s also the entity that I refer when it comes to the metaphysical results I experienced during evocation. I would dare say the entity is drawn to me as well because out of all the others in the grimoires, this is the one entity I honed in on.
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Which one is it? Or is that a secret?
No, it’s not a secret. King Belial.
@ChrisK Again, to say that I experienced absolutely nothing in all my evocations of King Belial is disingenuous. If you go up the thread, I do outline what I experienced. I also feel, sometimes, and maybe I’m crazy, like he’s speaking for me and I have an extra layer of confidence. With that being said, I have not seen him, heard him or have yet experienced what I asked for from him. I just want to thrown in the qualifier that I asked for something very reasonable and I always provided offerings.
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I did not read every single post in this thread, due to lack of time. Thanks for the clarification.
If you will take some advice from me, I work with all kinds of deities and that includes what would normally be considered biblical.
I have never worked with Belial, I think he might be based on Baal, if I recall. I find that it is best to go back to the original source of whatever deity you may want to contact and petition, that will give you the best chance of success.
For instance, a lot of people on the LHP work with Astaroth and that’s fine, but I find that she responds best and prefers being invoked as her oldest, original form, which is Inanna.
Just doing research on a deity, finding out their story and if possible, visiting original artefacts connected to their worship will increase the chances of your working being successful a great deal.
I connected to Inanna (as well as Enki and Utu) originally by visiting the Uruk exhibit in the British museum and forming an energetic connection to them through these original artefacts. That is just one method, but I find it to be most effective. A religiously consecrated statue or relief of a deity is their living embodiment and it helps focus your energies in order to establish a bond. Just witness the reverence by which Hindus and Buddhists treat statues of their own deities, especially during religious festivals. This all serves a purpose.
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@ChrisK I read about people’s experiences with him on here. Some were positive; others not so much. The constant refrain I heard is that he will test you and sometimes, turn your life upside down to make you stronger and so that you can get to your objective. Looking back, at my first crack at evocation and when I evoked him, I believe, that is exactly what happened. I get it; I know he’s powerful and to most people here, he’s a demon they “work with” for a time. For me it’s different; I can’t explain it. Monotheism and my upbringing aside, I’m drawn to him.
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@ChrisK Thanks for the tip but Baal and Belial are two separate entities. Beelzebub is associated with the Caananite god Baal.
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Ah yes, indeed, correct.
you want results or you want philosophical debate? it seems your focus or intent is the later base on your arguments instead of trying to figure out how to get results.
All the stuff you mention about signs. is that not proof of some magick happening? yet you keep saying it’s not working. ARe you seeing reality of what’s there ? Or are you just denying cuz it’s not ‘exactly’ as you expect?
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Here is my opinion on evocation esp using “ruling spirits”, protections, wards, etc. It is for absolute cowards. Yes, I INVOKE, if possible, various spirits. I got over the fear when I let go that death is merely a minor inconvenience. Parasites, controlling beings, tricksters, lashes, pain… that is all minor distractions.
Why does one do magic?
What does one ultimately seek?
Maybe in a round-about way we “serve” this god but only by being created. I’m a being that can’t stand constraints. And, the paradox is I adore them at the same time. I seek GOD or w/e people want to call the supposed ALL CONTROLLER. Maybe its just a mass of ever growing existence with no true sentience. Dunno, but if it is a being that DEMANDS subservience then it can bring the pain. I’ll mock it so maybe it will flex its god poeers to amp up said pain an infinite times more than everything in existence ever suffered and focus it on my wee widdle nothing of a spec of a being.
What’s big daddy gonna do? SPANK ME with utter annihilation. Oh boo hoo. Big daddy is just sooo bad.
Please. That’s pathetic and people snivelling and begging for mercy to be its bitch assed slave can suck its ever flowing heaven cock.
I’ll say it again. It breached free-will by creating. It is guilty of ALL supposed sins we seem to impose. But honestly, I think those priests in their orders are the corruption and liars and deceivers. And mostly. COWARDS!
I AM!
And I’LL BE!
I’M ME!
No god, no demon, no man, no being in existence will change that. I’ll tread where demons of the mind, body, and soul won’t because unlike then I seek to test the All Being that maybe it should ASK if a being wants to exist. If it can’t do that then it doesn’t get respect or even nod.
I don’t want its pathetic bribes.
I don’t care for its threats and shaming.
I don’t care fir its supposed virtues and vices system that man seems to have adopted.
And if it doesn’t exist… well then; man who created this to control other men for $$$ and power can fuck off. The reaper claims all.
Demon… possessed please. If anything those beings are one of the few things that keep me from snuffing out my life light.
And for the time being I am appeased.
I’m focused on learning and obtaining results. While I got an A+ in philosophy at a prestigious school, results is my goal. If you read up on this thread, I specifically mention metaphysical occurrences during evocation that in my view, cannot be explained by environmental factors. I say that to say that of recent, I have not posted on here, “This is not real.” I know better. I’m simply saying that what I asked deities during evocations have not come to pass. Moreover, I have not heard or seen a deity during evocation. That’s all. If you had results and you regularly see, speak and hear deities during evocation; great for you. My goal is to get there but I’m not there yet. That’s all.
Here’s an unusual tip - sleep deprivation. Drugs such as shrooms, amphetamines, and acid helped me summon demons, but nothing has helped quite like sleep deprivation. Stay up 72 hours straight, and then try summoning demons. Such sleep deprivation puts you in a somnolent state, and you’re much more connected to the dream/spirit world, because you’re closer to it.
If you stay up 72 hours straight and then try to summon them, I swear on my kids it will work. Don’t settle for 48 hours, do it at least 72, or 108 if you can. Amphetamines help. I’ve stayed up a week on meth and summon demons, and it is TREMENDOUSLY successful. Like, you don’t just “feel” the demons, you are surrounded in every sense of the word.
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Welcome @JUGGALO It is a rule of this forum for all new members to properly introduce themselves, so PLEASE CLICK THE IMAGE BELOW and tell us about yourself and any experience you may have in magick, such as what you practice, how long you have practiced, areas of interest, etc:
