How do you know what level of a mage you are

As usual TheStorm, I can rely on you to give an open, honest and well considered / informed response. Thank-you.


I find the concept of levels meaningless, but the world would be better if people only taught what they themselves can reliably do, and in magick that means being able to create changes in manifest reality.

The process of compiling this into teachable format will have value to the aspiring teacher, because it requires going back to the beginner mindset to start laying out the words, and then proceeding from there through to taking the student to at least that point of competency.

If everyone on here only taught what they are capable of, and laid out stages of what they have done in any thread sharing a working, concerns about a lack of “masters” or that old favourite “the blind leading the blind” would become meaningless.


Because you do not need to be a perfected human being to be a powerful black magician, and that spans the entire field from healing to curses - you just need to have methods and/or spirits that work.

Anything else starts verging on the idea that only one worldview, personality type, or lineage can ever accomplish powerful magick, which is bullshit.


@TheStorm, sorry … Typo … PTO was supposed to be OTO, Ordo Templi Orientis or something. A Crowley pilot or spinoff, is my hunch. ODR, Ordo Dragon Rouge I know about through Qabalah Qlippoth and Goetic Magic by Karlsson.
I think corruption occurs within any group or current eventually, or weakens naturally.
BMoA and Book of Mormon was referring to the vast extreme between the two.

So for example, back in September 2017, I listed out how to be adept level in a year.
So since I slacked off a bit, hopping back on, just adding one grade level to initiate into and assimilate. Two months per element.
Months. Self-Initiation-GD MM OAA
Feb/Mar. 0-1 (complete Earth). 1-3. 1-4
Apr/May. 2. (Complete Air) 4. 5-7
Jun/Jul. 3. (Water) 5. 8-10
Aug/Step. 4. (Fire). 6. 11-14
Oct/??? 5. (Portal). 7-12. 15-18

So daily …
Stretch, Relaxation Rituals
Morning solar adoration
Morning Salutation
Qabbalistic Cross
Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram (IAS)
Lesser Ritual of the Hexagram (I)
Qabbalistic Cross
Shem, Classic, Greek, Celtic Middle Pillar
Prayer of the Elementals

Noon Solar Adoration
Study grade material

Asana, Pranayama, Meditation
Evening Solar Adoration
Evening Salutation
Rose Cross Ritual, Watchtower
SMP/Evoke Angels of the two signs
Divination - Relaxation Ritual, Breathwork
Goetic Evocation
Study grade material
Astral Work
Prayer of the Elementals

Midnight Solar Adoration
Study grade material
Fall Asleep to Positive Affirmations or Power of the Presence of God (HGA) GDCD.


Set goals.
So for me, do all those every day.
Introduce color visualization and add daily hexagram invoking for the planet of the day.
Get astral senses and travel going.
Get perfect.

It’s not about your level so much as do you know the proper and effective way to do certain things?

Magic is a result-oriented field. You either can do things or you can’t. That requires centredness, breathwork, focus, visualization, ability to bind thoughts to objects and link them, development of certain trance phenomena and psychic abilities, some supraluminal communication skills or a connection to natural objects for illumination.

You don’t always need a lot of skill to do certain things. With natural magick you just need to follow the routines, or there are shortcuts such as blood magick or petition/name papers for calling spirits quickly. But generally, magick presupposes you have certain psychic or psychological skills the average person doesn’t have.

This is how i measure my ability in this game. There’s a lot i can’t do, but i know a few things. Ymmv, so find your own way to keep your score so you can gauge your true ability. When you know what you honestly can and can’t do, you know what needs work and you don’t bite off more than you can chew.

I also wrote this in 2015, after nearly a decade of doing magick every day. it offers some food for thought and a few reasons i’ve personally been involved in that explain why the magick didn’t work. As i’ve said before, my personal success rate is around 2/11, so for every 11 rituals i do, 9 of them either fizzle out or i get something other than what i expected. I can only claim 2 perfect results out of every 11 attempts. With that said, some of my results have been fucking incredible, so take that fwiw.


Sometimes I deemed necessary to humbly reset myself as an atheist or Christian (well, not completely so), while studying again the basics of Magick or some esotericism (e.g. Evola, Guénon). According to an Italian folk book of magick, progressing from novice to initiate and finally master would be automatic, as the magician studies and practice; the first almost begs, the second uses persuasion and the last one commands.

1 Like

well on WoW i used to be lvl 24

1 Like

Well, since I am only roleplaying anyway, apparently, so I can say I am high leveled and get away with it.

1 Like

There’s no levels, you summon that being when you feel like you’re ready lol. Not when someone thinks you have to be something they made up to do it lol.


@anon48079295 agree :+1:

There are no levels, there is only knowledge, and the pursuit of it.


Dunno if I have managed to comment yet, but there isn’t really a level cap to measure yourself against. There’s no true limit here.


I’m definitely Supreme Overlord.

(Honestly I don’t believe in levels everyone has different things they are better at and can tap into better, while others have to work harder at it, I know my strength and weakness and I’m still learning, as I believe everyone should do)


Everyone you meet is your teacher, they either teach you what to do or what not to do. Either way I’m grateful for it…


Well, if you are playing Skyrim on an xbox console, press Y, going up to skills, and your level will be on the top of the screen towards the center.

All jokes aside, unless you are in an order that has a degree system, there is no level are far as far as working magic goes. The more you practice and learn from it, the stronger you’ll get. Best way to see where you are at is to experiment whatever “type” of magic you are working with and make a record of it as well as the results (or lack of) that came from it. As time passes, you could notice how far you have progressed as a magician. But I am babbling now. Just my two cents. I hope this helps in some way.


I really like your mentality. That’s an excellent point. There seems to be so much to learn and such a variety of Magick out there that many are at different levels in different areas. We can learn from many if we apply the lessons we learn.

1 Like

I agree. One thing that kept me from studying ritual Magick for years was that so many people I knew seemed to try to make it into a social club or clique. I get that belonging to a tribe is a basic human need, but I had no idea that there was something other than Orders (which felt too much like church to me) until I found BALG.

In my still fairly brief time on here I have seen what I believe are many master Mages (who I won’t tag because they are probably very busy) who have used Magick to do amazing things. I have also read some posts on here that feel like someone was LARPing (I.e. claiming they could make Shazam and superheroes appear in the flesh to do battle or have tea time with all the Gods one day after starting). I think some want attention but most on here seem to be generally interested in growth which I really appreciate.

I’m pretty sure even the master mages would admit that they learn new things all the time. Everyone does. Having a mentor can be very useful. But, the need for an official hierarchy or “Level” that prevents how far someone can advance, feels like a group that just has unaddressed insecurity issues. But that’s just my opinion. Excelsior! :grinning:


Even fantasists may be having useful-for-them communion with internal archetypes, and figuring out conflicts and stuff. I mean it’s not always great when they dominate a thread and start laying down the law, but overall, people usually handle that pretty well if someone tries, and the value of personal roleplay can be very real to the person doing it.

Very little different, substantially, to Creating A "Cabinet Of Invisible Counselors". :thinking:

Society works really hard to crush people, sometimes the psychologically-necessary reaction to that can look a bit weird to outsiders.

Wise, wise words. :+1:


That’s a good point. One other thing I appreciate about the people, spirits, superheroes, gods, etc. on BALG is that people are pretty chill for the most part and encouraging of others to find themselves. I believe (IMHO) that many people who even have mental illnesses could find those improve with Magick and studies of the mind. I wish some of my other friends would research some of this but so many are conditioned to be scared of Magick (cos Ermagherd! It’s the Devil!!! )

From my continuing (exhaustive?) research of the BALG archives, I’ve also noticed that those rare ones who do become abusive on here don’t last long thanks to you and other hardworking folks efforts on here. Thanks for that. BALG is a pretty nice place. :slightly_smiling_face:

1 Like