Different spirits actually being the same being

Greetings,

During my mostly failed career of evoking/invoking spirits I have ran into some eerie similarities that suggest individually perceived beings are actually either aspects or simply masks of a same being. Not in the sense that “all is Mind” and that they are but simple facets of the magician’s psyche or an All-Being (disregard that bullshit).

So far I’ve found, at least in my perception, that:

  1. Azazel and the Greek god Apolo are the same being.

  2. That the being commonly evoked in Luciferian Satanism is not actually Lucifer but Azazel himself.

  3. That, apparently, many gods of old were masks or cultural perceptions and variations of entities found in the Goetia. Some are blatantly obvious such as Astaroth and Ishtar, but I imply that in a deeper aspect (such as Marduk = Azazel again).

Please notice that my experience is fairly limited and that I do not claim such things as truth, just as what I have perceived for now. The other thing I have noticed is that, at times, certain servitor spirits bound to Goetian spirits tend to either look like their master or at least practically masquerade as such.

What is your opinion on this?

3 Likes

What makes you think this? Let’s use the Azazel-Apollo example. When you evoked them, what caused you to believe they were the same being? Also, by Goetic servitor are you referring to the spirits within their legions (generals, lieutenants, etc) or actual human-made servitors?

2 Likes

How about the posibillity that azazel is Messing with you?

1 Like

How about the probability that he’s messing with himself?

1 Like

Very probable because the only thing he did was appear, shoot a glare at me, say “shut up” with a voice that sounded as powerful as crunching a whole tank into a neat little cube, and vanished.

As for Baphomet:

What caused me to think of this relation was through an exercise of logic that, without warning, became a sort of vision. More or less:

  1. That Right Hand Path and Left Hand Path were simply methods of approaching the occult, to achieve power, and that they were more or less based on answering two different questions: Who am I for the RHP and What do I want for the LHP.

  2. That the so called hierarchy between gods, angels and demons, and the so called origin of evil were simply bullshit, that there is no such thing as “good” or “evil” but merely factions, and that the human nature has gotten used to find something external to blame for their own faults.

  3. That the semi animalistic appearance of demons was a double entendre: The fusion between the enlighted and material aspects of existance, that the cause of evil was fear and ignorance, that matter and spirit need not be two separate dimensions yet merely aspects of a whole existance.

And, making a long story brief? That people with a certain degree of power (economical, occult, whatever it be) used to excuse their own vices and bankrupt morality as caused by the so called Devil. That Luciferian cults and the like obtained power through working with demonic entities, no doubt, but that for the extent of their actions there was no one else to blame but themselves.

In other words: Hurr durr I do horrible things to people because Lucifer told me to, not because I am a sick fuck.

The vision that flashed in my mind during this “logic thinking” was of a statue of Apolo, and then of a bright, tall man of perfect proportions acknowledging my train of thought.

That is why I think that Apolo/Lucifer/Azazel are the same entity, but I know this thinking must be flawed when countless other magicians would tell me otherwise.

And all I got during my evokation is for a large, brilliant white face to appear and tell me to shut up before I even managed to finish reciting. Then it went on its way D: Wtf man.

2 Likes

Sorry I forgot to answer that. I meant some of the spirits within their legions, not egregores made by men. Either by resembling them too closely to the description found in books yet being “off” by some detail or two. My take on this is that their coming was a test or sorts, to see if I was ready or serious.

1 Like

My opinion is to wait until a spirit tells you they’re connected to another before applying that idea in an evocation or other work.

Nobody human likes to be stereotyped as being like another person just because of superficial similarities and most spirits have their pride as well - you certainly don’t want to offend them even more, on top of the problems you’ve already encountered! :slight_smile:

I’ve met lots of people who look, act, and think in similar ways and while it’s useful to notice patterns, none of them would be won over by me denying them their own identity based on assumptions.

A lot of people have UPG that causes them to conflate different beings down to a handful of archetypes, other people’s UPG & experiences are the opposite - I’m in the latter group.

But regardless of which is objectively true, it’s most polite to wait until you’ve been told by the spirit, and perhaps verified it in some way as well.

3 Likes

You have a very good grasp of who these entities are.
For example if you would take 30 minutes of your own time and go in depth at researching different gods and goddesses then you could start to find so many links between vertian gods and goddesses. When i mean links i mean that one god or goddess has many aspects of themselves.
But there are two spirita who have a shit ton of aspects associated with them.
Lilith is one of them she is known as Lilitu in Sumerian mythology… From this you can link her to Inanna/Ishatar… To Isis… To Hecate… To Asteroth… To Nyx… To Venus… To Freya… To Sif… To Mastema… To Gaia… To Rhea… To many other aspects. Please don’t judge me, because you need to do your own indepent research. Remeber to leave all of your bias at the door.
Now the second spirit is known as Satan… He is known as Enki/Ea… You link him to Beelzebub… To Anu… To Danu… To Thor… To Lucifer… To Azazel… To Piamon… To Zeus… To Apollo… To Odin… To Set… To Osiris… To Dammu… To many other aspects.
These two spirits are two of the oldest and most powerful spirits.
I will not give you full disclosure on who they both really are. Because you can not just take me on my word alone you need your own proof, so what i say to you is that you need to go seek that proof for yoursleves.
Love,
Elena

2 Likes

333 According to my personal Gnosis we will work together in the Future, as i recently feel a call from Chorozon 333.

Regarding your Question:

I do believe in different Layors / Spheres and the General inability to manage and adjust to slight frequency changes at the beginning of working into real Astral skills / Telepathy / Clearvoyance.

One of the most encountered issues for me was, to derevate Spirite Voice from Memory Voice, and from actual Human Voice.

One of the Reasons for this, is that i actually went quite deep with the direct Envokation of other Magicians by having a lack of expierience both with book-knowledge, as well as Spirit communication Knowledge.

Bearing that in mind, i would like to emphezise 2 great teachings i had on my own personal path, and i never liked to see slip: IF YOU CAN EVOKE - YOU CAN BANISH! - This General empowerment is usually even strengthened by Tower Ritual / Grow Huge etc.
In simple Terms, it remindes you of Confidence, as well as inner Strength and actually using that until you reach a grade of Competance - where you rather rely on the fact that you KNOW you allready succeeded plenty of times then assuming you will succeed. - (beware of blind pride, as that is usually a way to fall short onto yourself).

besides that, the secound teaching was “Once you really hear different voices then your own inside of you, carefully seperate and identify, who’s actually speaking to you.”

That, however is the much more difficult part.

It really makes the Adept, and it really keeps a challange as sometimes even prooven Gnosis and even Divinations can be repelled to you, sometimes exactly by the Person Who’s Spirit requested the Working to go down.

This, for my own expierience made a huge Impact, as i found myself being unsatisfied with some Outcomes i worked quite hard for.

And i know that MANY MANY other Sorcerers and Witches can relate to the expierience of “being disappointed, by the final bitter end. - far after the sweet kiss a Holiday movie would have ended at.”

Sorry, These termonology seems most apropriate.

Sincerely,

¥’Berioth

1 Like

Sorry I don’t reply any more, I’m kinda busy with stuff, will keep in contact.

1 Like

@Lady_Eva I believe the connection of Apollo & Azazel is When Azazel was known as Shamash the sun god of divination and law. That bled through to Greek Apollo later in babylon when the greek empire took over.

1 Like

Shamash and Azazel are the same?

1 Like

One of his babylonian masks in the past :slight_smile:

2 Likes

Well, so basically what you describe here sounds much like you worked tremendously deep with a sorcerer on your Focus, more then the actual Entitys that Sorcerer Invoked and Evoked.

To be fair: There are Spirits which have common ground.
Many work together, some work for each other.

But when i look at Lucifer, and Azazel, and Marduk, they differ quite a bit, whatched from outside.

For example, Marduk had a much stronger Need to get Things pushed to a final End, then Azazel or Lucifer did. Lucifer surely had a blinding blur to his presence - one of the sensations hard to overcome such quickly, as he often leaves a Long Lasting imprint of resembling expiriences after him. Anf of Course, his high Rank makes many other Spirits actually flee and reside at distance when he is Close. And Azazel… Man, he doesn’t give a shit. Azazel if at all linked to Lucifer, is much more like satan to me. He really likes hitting fast, which i wouldn’t compare to satan directly. Satan, for me rather likes to hit hard and never have to hit a secound time. so in that sense…
Marduk might go the closest with Satan. :wink:

Oh yaah, there’s definatly been some doubtful situations, where clearly more then just one of them resided. it’s actually one of the downsides i liked to avoid, but i noticed it becomming more normal and acceptable over time: having a open relation / open gate towards several influences, which continue to work alongside…
It made some stuff quite political.
Personal Politics, however, are a Little like flavours.
The Joy can vary, while in the end, there surely is some true effect’s coming out of These sensations.

And just like a taste,
some Things completly deplete,
no matter how well stored or written down they were,
until you actually trigger them again.

In that sense, Magick made me Aware of tons of vournabilitys i had to notice and actually acknowledge.

However, that also showed clearly, how much of a difference it is, weather something is spoken, or done.
Doing, in a way, is completly different then Thinking.

:wink:

Sincerely,

¥’B

I’m curious as to where you draw these connections. And a few of these Spirits exist on the same pantheon: Nyx, Venus, Gaia, Rhea, and Hecate for example are all Goddesses of the Greco-Roman Pantheon yet apparently their all Lilith. But, the “spirits” Lilith and Satan were orginally kinds of spirits, like angels and demons, they were originally liliths and satans and so the rest of your connections is comical in it’s utter ridiculousness.

Lilith (Lilitu) in her original Mesopotamian mythology was a kind of demoness, similar to how Satan (Shaytan) was originally a kind of angel in early Judaism. Lilitu, and their male counterparts, Lilu, were sex demons. They were also connected with the Mesopotamian Goddess Inanna as her prostitutes (which is the original meaning of succubus in Latin). When the Hebrews went into Babylonian captivity they brought back with them to Israel a lot of new beliefs and this is where they first mentioned the liliths (yes, plural because lilith, like shaytan, is a type of demon).

The first refrerences to Lilith in Judaism are offand comments in the Babylonian Talmud. Describing her as having wings and long hair. The translation suggests that they understood Lilith as the name of a specific entity.

An inscription on a Jewish incantation bowl (it would be buried upside down on the property to trap spirits) from the 4th AD - 6th AD says, “Thou liliths, male lili and female lilith, hag and ghool, I adjure you by the Strong One of Abraham, by the Rock of Isaac, by the Shaddai of Jacob, by Yah Ha-Shem by Yah his memorial, to turn away from this Rashnoi b. M. and from Geyonai b. M. her husband. [Here is] your divorce and writ and letter of separation, sent through holy angels. Amen, Amen, Selah, Halleluyah!”

This goes back to the original concept of Lilith being a kind of spirit, as opposed to a specific spirit.

And then, we get the Alphabet of Ben Sira, 8th AD - 10th AD, and this is the first reference to the legend of Lilith being the first wife of Adam. But it has this weird part that says, “‘Leave me!’ she said. ‘I was created only to cause sickness to infants. If the infant is male, I have dominion over him for eight days after his birth, and if female, for twenty days.’ When the angels heard Lilith’s words, they insisted she go back. But she swore to them by the name of the living and eternal God: ‘Whenever I see you or your names or your forms in an amulet, I will have no power over that infant.’ She also agreed to have one hundred of her children die every day. Accordingly, every day one hundred demons perish, and for the same reason, we write the angels’ names on the amulets of young children. When Lilith sees their names, she remembers her oath, and the child recovers.”

And that has a connection to Lamashtu, a Demon-Goddess of Mesopotamian mythology who is responsible for killing children, as well as diseases and chaos in general. It’s possible that ideas from Lamashtu were combined with the Lilitu to create the Jewish Lilith that we know today.

And Satan, ohmygoshIhavewrittenaboutthetruehistoryofsatansomanytimesIfeellikeI’mgoingtogocrazy.

Originally, Satan was a type of angel, the shaytan. He was an accusing angel who accused men before God, he’s like the prosecution in our modern courts. It wasn’t until the Jews went into the Babylonian exile and encountered Zoroastrianism that they stole Ahriman and rebranded him as Shaytan, now a specific name. Other things that changed during the influence of Zoroastrianism: Henotheism to Monotheism, God is in control of good and evil to God is in control of only good and Satan is in control of the evil, The only judgement that exists is in this life to there is an afterlife where the righteous are rewarded and sinners are punished, among others.

Edit: I’m fine with UPG and personal views and beliefs. That stuff I won’t touch. But, the moment someone starts talking about research, evidence, and proof I tend to call bullshit. Because most people don’t actually know what their talking about.

2 Likes

Yeah some even connect Lilith originally to Ninlil wife Enlil. Before the added demon qualities of there stay in the underworld transformed her into Liliake & Lilitu, when she reappears as the hand of Inanna/Ishtar.

1 Like