Demons: An individual spirit or more than one

General Discussion
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Excuse me if this was asked before, I could not find anything similar.

Been talking the other day with a friend. To summarize, he said he doesn’ believe in demons per se. He said he believes there are some spirits who like to use the names of demons. Let’s say Lucifer. The demon Lucifer, as it comes in the Goetia, Bible, etc, doesn’t exist. There are some powerful spirits who call themselves Lucifer, and they trick us into thinking they are the true Lucifer. So I could be evoking a spirit and you may be evoking a different one, both using the same name.

Other opinions make me question what are demons really like.
Some comments about demons seen on r/occult.
e.g: “you’d be insane not to use a barrier between you and them. No they don’t like it, why? Because they can’t get out and do what they want. If you can’t hold and compell them, then they have no incentive to do as you ask, and possession is a serious threat at that point if not worse. Personally I always use a hermetic binding circle has never failed me once even for greater entities. My house my rules. Basically if you don’t you may as well hold up a sign that says come and get me boys fresh meat.”

“Demons are not evil but they will fuck you up or exploit you. Some of them will relate to you and they will go easy on you and might even help you even if you don’t know what the fuck you are doing. Most will not.”

tldr: Some people say demons don’t exist per se, others say they’re evil af and will f you up, others believe they aren’t evil nor good, just livings with personality…
What’s the ultimate truth? Sorry if I’m wandering lol

EDIT: I myself have been “called” by two demons, but I would like to know what you guys think before trying to contact one and f everything up

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Both are kinda accurate, there are beings who will try and play with gullible occultists and claim the name of a actual well known being for energy, this goes for thoughtforms too, but the issue with thoughtforms are that some occultists accidently create mimics of the actual beings and in doing so, these beings become leeches trying to keep themselves from fading from the astral by preying on those who would be gullible enough to believe them, thoughtforms need belief of any kind to sustain themselves.

So yes while demons exist as individuals there are some beings and thoughtforms who will try and use the name to feed off people BUT there are also beings who share a name, just like we humans share names, there’s no one guy named drake, or one girl named Alice, however they as individuals differ.

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There are two places to never go for occult advice.

  • r/occult

  • /x/

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First off Lucifer is a name we humans have to an aspect of our universe. The most important aspect definitely but still it’s a name we gave it. It’s actual name is not pronounced with spoken word but exists as it being what it is as in the thought of concept of it. When you are talking to Lucifer and as what it is in concept then you understand that you are talking to the god consciousness it’s self basically you are talking to god himself. Now the same goes for all other aspects of the universe they have many names from many cultures the world around or even names given to them by individuals and that works just fine so long as it’s a name given to a recognized aspect of the universe. Now as for lesser spirits such as woodland spirits or the ghosts of the dead or some random poltergeist etc. They may have had names and their nature could be anything and could behave in any way. But as far as aspects of the universe or the gods as they are commonly referred to are pretty much consistent in their nature as it reflects the aspect they represent. This is known as the current the universal aspect it’s self and the mask of the current is the cultural name and perception or version of that aspect. I hope that helps.

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Damn good to know now, thanks

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It really helps, thank you!!

Well that really really makes sense, I thought it would be something like that too. Thank you!

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There are some powerful spirits who call themselves Lucifer, and they trick us into thinking they are the true Lucifer. So I could be evoking a spirit and you may be evoking a different one, both using the same name.

– THIS IS TRUE, I BEEN TOLD, THAT I HAVE HAD INCARNATION, WHEN I WAS NAMED LUCIFER, AND I ALSO HAD SISTER NAMED ANIFER, SO IN A WAY I COULD BE CALLED LUCIFER, IN ASTRAL, IF I HAVE SPIRITS FROM THAT TIME STILL WITH ME, EVEN THO I DONT LIKE THE NAME, I TREAT LUCIFER MORE LIKE TITLE NOW…

dont use barriers, you look like zoo animal to any high being you are trying to communicate with if you do lol… i didnt even remember people uses barriers, see its about concious energy/conciousness transerf, its not about barriers, they can touch you all the time, but wont get anything from YOU, unless you want open 2way transaction…

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Easy way to avoid a random being with the same name is to refine your focus. Don’t use random sigils you find online. I prefer to either make my own or ask the being themselves for a personal sigil from them to use as a direct line to them. It also helps to learn how to scan so you know you’re actually talking to the right one you want and not a random or thoughtform.

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What is the difference between them and you saying that our astral bodies are not like that. Is it because we have souls?

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They have souls too, unless you mean the thoughtforms then no they don’t.

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So that’s why thoughtforms need belief to stay alive? Why can they just vamp energy from the astral plane?

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Thoughtforms are thoughts given form, they live off the fact people believe in them and give form to their existence. Feeding off ambient energy in the astral isn’t the same as gaining a bunch of people believing in them either negatively or positively. If someone were to “kill” a thoughtform, they would simply reform because their existence is remembered by someone(s) of course after enough energy they have gained from such they could develop into egregores then to godforms (not to be confused with the idea that everyone has a godform) but more in terms of once a thoughtform reaches “Godform” it doesn’t need belief in it to sustain itself, it just lives off the aforementioned ambient energy of the astral. Ambient energy isn’t as “filling” as the energy a thoughtform can get from many people acknowledging its existence through positive belief or negative fear. However as a Godform it can sustain itself off very little.

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In my opinion, they are both. Individual spirits united and acting as one “all” spirit. A concept that humans can’t understand or practice to this day, successfully.

Good and evil doesn’t exist in nature. The Angel that brings destruction is perceived as a Demon, and the Demon that heals is praised as an Angel. But there are rules, principles and order that governs those spiritual powers, even the ones who work for Chaos. Chaos and order are only two sides of the same coin… just like light and darkness.

The war between demons and angels is a religious myth, as far as I know. Higher forces of destruction and creation in nature are not at war. They both serve the same purpose. Evolution of life and intelligence. They are in harmony, but they do not cross paths.

There are individual spirits which doesn’t belong to any higher order. And those, while enjoying their freedom, realize their limitations and do not leave their playground, so to speak. If one of them try to trick someone by pretending to be another spirit of higher order, they usually get severely punished or get killed for it. By magicians and/or the higher ranked spirits they pretend to be.

We do not see most of that from our side, because we’re focusing on our direct relationships with spirits, not how their realms operate or governed. Especially with modern magick that concentrates on being practical and bringing results more than anything else.

In eastern traditions of witchcraft, for example, magicians explored this hidden side more deeply and mentioned their findings in their manuscripts. Most of which were passed from generation to generation, few parts were publicly published.

In practice, this kind of information doesn’t really matter that much to be honest. It only makes a difference in rare circumstances. For example, when two magicians, are working with the same spirit for the same target or against each other. In this case, this information becomes useful.

Of course this is my opinion based on my understanding and experience, which is still a work in progress. Can’t claim it’s true or false.

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