Can a person change their natal chart / astrology using free will?

like seriously. My natal placements suck :unamused:

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What do you mean? Like can you actually change where the planets were? I don’t think so.

If you mean can you change the personality you believe you have because of your placements, then I think the answer is yes. I don’t know a whole lot about astrology, but I know a bit. The way I see it, a natal chart is your starting point and sometimes points to things in your life but that doesn’t mean that you can’t grow as a person.

Also, have you checked your tropical and vedic placements? I know some people don’t resonate at all with one system but have a much better time with another.

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I’ve checked them yeah @meow . My main thing is that despite free choice, would the universe try to force whatever the astrology placements say or is astrology all in our heads? At this point I’m too indoctrinated to have clear perspective I feel

I wouldn’t use the word force. I think it’s about alignment. If someone is a believer of astrology, then they likely believe that they’re aligned with their placements. I don’t think any of this is about the universe forcing someone to be what they aren’t. Beyond that, I’m not sure how to answer your question differently.

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No I think I get it. Basically astrology is only existent if we believe in it yeah?

You can bind unfavourable planetary influences in your chart so they do not affect you.

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Not what I’m saying. I’m just trying to remove myself from the situation. I’ve read enough about astrology to know I respect it, but not enough to know how certain I am that it dictates the way people are.

I’m saying, that astrology is more about a person being in alignment with their placements than it is about the universe forcing someone to take a certain path in life. I’m not sure how distinct those things sound, but in my head they’re different.

You cannot change a Natal chart. It is the moment you took your first breath. You can resist negative influences, as well as petition good ones. Natal charts are what signs you were born under, and thus what will influence your whole life. Progression charts and daily charts are the influences of a given day in the moment or in the future. But they aren’t set in stone, necessarily. For example, if having a Pisces Moon means you act over emotional all the time, you can learn to steel yourself. That doesn’t mean you’re not a Pisces Moon anymore, it means it’s a challenge you have to take conscious effort towards your whole life.

Astrology isn’t absolute destiny, it’s a challenge and a set of common likelihoods that influence you. Influence doesn’t mean permanent. Do shadow work and work on the challenges the chart presents to you.

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See your birth chart as your house with many different rooms, your free will is your ability to choose which room you wanna go but within the limit of house. It’s not good to bind the energy of the planet, it’s not a good remedy.
Instead research on the planets, what they are doing in your birth chart for example a certain planet in the 5th house of creativity, fame, children can give you great children but you may not be creative or vice versa.
Let take another example with the 7th house of marriage, partnership, business, agreement, a planet in the 7th house can give you great abilities for business, but gives hardship in your relationship, the mistake will be to TRY to bind that planet’s influence because if you do so you gonna kill your business too, The best advise would be to switch your focus from business to your relationship, you can let someone else run from time to time your business and you have more time with your wife or man.

Each planet gives you a certain type of energy, vibration but you are the only one to choose how to use it ( unconsciously or consciously)

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Not really, their influence is there whether you believe in them or not.

No, all you’ve got, if you believe it, is a tendency to have your energy flow in a given way.
You are the only one responsible for what you do with that, and how you feel, and you can choose to behave how you will.

Funilly enough I had a person once tell me he’s released all his sun sign associateion and was zodiac free or something, ad meanwhile was acting more like his sun sign than anyone I’ve ever met, so that was funny. :smiley:

I think the more you worry about ot the more you’ll bring what you fear towards you. So stop worrying about it and just make the best decisions you can in every situation. Just knowing to tend to act in a given way and you don’t want to, is enough to be aware and mindful, and in control. This is not just for planets, it’s also true for childhood training, personality quirks and bugbears, it’s part of knowing yourself.

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There is the sentence “astra inclinant non necessitant”, an occultist explains that the Fool from Tarot stays with crossed arms and meets the astrological fate while the Magician is able to apply solutions.

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One can certainly take steps to appease planets (through mantra chanting, use of yantras, stones, planetary oils and incense, offerings to Hindu gods and goddesses, and so forth), counteract and nullify such afflictions. @Dankquanicus and @DarkestKnight may have some more techniques to achieve that.

Here’s an example of mantra chanting:

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Interesting question. Well, first you have to be sure you are skilled and knowledged enough to know what a particular placement means regarding your life.

There were two popular traditional western views. The Medieval/Renaissance European view is as @fapa79 quotes, “Astra inclinant non necessitant”, which you can translate as “The stars incline but do not compel”. Christianity holds that free will exists, so at least it was not popular to say the stars rule everything in a person’s life.

The Stars and Planets (Or, that spiritual influence they point towards) rule over the spirit, and the emotions, desires, and passions are ruled by the spirit. So what you do through your desires, passions, and emotions is following fate. Now we see that it is very difficult to move beyond fate. In fact, it is rare enough that various contemporary traditional astrologers don’t believe you can move beyond fate. Others do. But with the above, try to think, when are we not acting out of our emotions and desires? It is very rare moments that we act purely from the divine soul, which is traditionally above fate.

Another traditional view is of the Stoics, that everything is indeed fated and this cannot be moved beyond.

Both views are certainly fine. The Free Will view is certainly nice if you feel you’ve been given a fate that you don’t like. You can certainly at least try to move beyond it. I want to add that my experience also suggests it is very difficult and rare to move beyond fate. I have done more than 800 or so divinatory readings in my main system of divination, Geomancy, and in only around 10 or so of those that I recall was the chart read “wrong” or innacurate. In some, the querent appeared to move beyond fate, and in others, where the subject was inanimate, the chart appeared to be wrong.
So, to me appears that fate is difficult to move beyond, but it can be done.

This is also a beautiful story! Some people seem to try and run away from fate but ironically appead to be very subject to it.

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In my opinion planets give results according to your past karma, present actions and unfulfilled desires (past or present). It is almost impossible to change them. You may think you are changing your fate but that window you opened for change was actually allowed in your birth chart, astrology is so vast and complex. These planets have been there for billions of years, it affects billions and trillions of people, I don’t think a simple mantra can change that and remember their results depends on you ! You are the doer of the planetary alignment in your chart. each planets knows that it playing part and you don’t wanna appease only one planet cause that planet has aspects, maybe is in conjunction with other planet, by appeasing it you may change certain planets too in a negative way Planets act as whole in a chart. Allow their energy to flow… a Mars that gives you anger issues, bad relationship with brothers or male friends but can be very good in career