1st evocation

[quote=“Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495”]Mark Chapter 11: Versus 22-24
SOURCE: ARAMAIC BIBLE IN PLAIN ENGLISH
22Yeshua answered and he said to them, “May the faith of God be IN you.” 23"For, amen, I say to you, whoever shall say to this mountain: ‘Be lifted up and fall into the sea’, and will not doubt in his heart but shall believe that thing which he says, anything that he says shall be done for him."[/quote]

Why do you always bring Christianity into it? That’s not what this thread is about.

You’re taking the Bible literally and you’re taking Koetting’s “Become a Living God” mantra literally. If you’d like to prove me wrong I’d be open to witnessing you rising a mountain and then making it fall into the sea. You keep ending all your posts with “you are already god” so I’m sure you have no doubt in your abilities.

All that would do is cause arguments. I get enough of that on two other forums I moderate. Our experiences differ. What point is there to keep restating our same stances just with different words? You’re not going to change my mind and I’m not going to change yours. All we’ll do is keep saying the same thing over and over. Again, I do enough of that on my two other forums.

[quote=“Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495”]This isn’t just conjecture. You’re claiming this is my opinion. It is not.

It’s my experience.[/quote]

If it’s not an opinion then it must be a fact. And facts are true for everyone, not just yourself or a small group. Unfortunately, my experience differs so it cannot be a fact. In my experience, calling a Voudon spirit under the names of a Norse deity won’t get you anywhere except frustration.

That should be obvious. I’ve stated it several times so far…

I’m sorry but this sounds like something out of The Secret or some Tony Robbins “you are your own best friend” speech at the Knowledge Expo. Even Yogis who have dedicated their lives to the spiritual arts can barely do things that would make the vast majority of mankind dub them as gods. Every once and a while you’ll hear stories about this monk being able to levitate or that swami being able to teleport, but those things are hearsay, witnessed by either a small group or people or people who are likely dead now and cannot be independently proven. I’m sorry but the fact is we aren’t the kind of gods you’d like to believe we are. If I shoot you and hit a major artery and you don’t get medical help in time you will die. If I choke you, you will die. If I put you in a car and blow it up, you will die. You cannot move mountains, you cannot fly, you cannot throw fire from your hands. We are human, we have limits. Magic can be used to make life easier but we won’t turn into something out of the latest M Night Shamaylan film.

You asked for my take, and there you have it. I do not wish to argue it as it serves no purpose and takes away from the main point of the thread. As I stated previously, I respect your opinion, and now I kindly ask that you respect mine.

You gotta be kidding me. I tried to end the conversation with a simple sentence saying that my experience differs but I respect your opinion. YOU’RE the one who keeps responding with book length responses attempting to keep the argument going…yet I’m the one trying to argue? #WhereIsTheLogicInThat?

[quote=“Baphomet, post:21, topic:2495”][quote=“Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495”]Mark Chapter 11: Versus 22-24
SOURCE: ARAMAIC BIBLE IN PLAIN ENGLISH
22Yeshua answered and he said to them, “May the faith of God be IN you.” 23"For, amen, I say to you, whoever shall say to this mountain: ‘Be lifted up and fall into the sea’, and will not doubt in his heart but shall believe that thing which he says, anything that he says shall be done for him."[/quote]

Why do you always bring Christianity into it? That’s not what this thread is about.

You’re taking the Bible literally and you’re taking Koetting’s “Become a Living God” mantra literally. If you’d like to prove me wrong I’d be open to witnessing you rising a mountain and then making it fall into the sea. You keep ending all your posts with “you are already god” so I’m sure you have no doubt in your abilities.

All that would do is cause arguments. I get enough of that on two other forums I moderate. Our experiences differ. What point is there to keep restating our same stances just with different words? You’re not going to change my mind and I’m not going to change yours. All we’ll do is keep saying the same thing over and over. Again, I do enough of that on my two other forums.

[quote=“Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495”]This isn’t just conjecture. You’re claiming this is my opinion. It is not.

It’s my experience.[/quote]

If it’s not an opinion then it must be a fact. And facts are true for everyone, not just yourself or a small group. Unfortunately, my experience differs so it cannot be a fact. In my experience, calling a Voudon spirit under the names of a Norse deity won’t get you anywhere except frustration.

That should be obvious. I’ve stated it several times so far…

I’m sorry but this sounds like something out of The Secret or some Tony Robbins “you are your own best friend” speech at the Knowledge Expo. Even Yogis who have dedicated their lives to the spiritual arts can barely do things that would make the vast majority of mankind dub them as gods. Every once and a while you’ll hear stories about this monk being able to levitate or that swami being able to teleport, but those things are hearsay, witnessed by either a small group or people or people who are likely dead now and cannot be independently proven. I’m sorry but the fact is we aren’t the kind of gods you’d like to believe we are. If I shoot you and hit a major artery and you don’t get medical help in time you will die. If I choke you, you will die. If I put you in a car and blow it up, you will die. You cannot move mountains, you cannot fly, you cannot throw fire from your hands. We are human, we have limits. Magic can be used to make life easier but we won’t turn into something out of the latest M Night Shamaylan film.

You asked for my take, and there you have it. I do not wish to argue it as it serves no purpose and takes away from the main point of the thread. As I stated previously, I respect your opinion, and now I kindly ask that you respect mine.

You gotta be kidding me. I tried to end the conversation with a simple sentence saying that my experience differs but I respect your opinion. YOU’RE the one who keeps responding with book length responses attempting to keep the argument going…yet I’m the one trying to argue? #WhereIsTheLogicInThat[/quote]

[quote=“Baphomet, post:21, topic:2495”][quote=“Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495”]Mark Chapter 11: Versus 22-24
SOURCE: ARAMAIC BIBLE IN PLAIN ENGLISH
22Yeshua answered and he said to them, “May the faith of God be IN you.” 23"For, amen, I say to you, whoever shall say to this mountain: ‘Be lifted up and fall into the sea’, and will not doubt in his heart but shall believe that thing which he says, anything that he says shall be done for him."[/quote]

Why do you always bring Christianity into it? That’s not what this thread is about. [/quote]
Because I’m a gnostic. I’ve stated that before, along with several things, but you still ask me what my tradition is. We practice ancient sorcery, and this man was a very buddhist sorcer, people like you are just too stupid to read any of the 24 original books the church burned that were way better than the anonymous 4 they wrote.

I also do it to drive a point, not only was Koetting a Mormon, but you can pay him 200 dollars to ask if Jesus was talking about this. Koetting has talked to me numerous times about how this man was a MASTER SORCERER of great power, and much is revealed in the bible, to those who are actually initiated into ancient sorcery.

[quote="Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495"]Yeshua always spake in parables, but this one is obvious to anyone who practices magick, if you are simply aware of your divine power within yourself, you can life up a mountain and make it fall into the sea, but this only happens if you do not have any doubt in your ability, if you can remove your doubt, you will become limitless.[/quote]

You’re taking the Bible literally and you’re taking Koetting’s “Become a Living God” mantra literally. If you’d like to prove me wrong I’d be open to witnessing you rising a mountain and then making it fall into the sea. You keep ending all your posts with “you are already god” so I’m sure you have no doubt in your abilities.


you’re really being a moron, absolutely, because yeshua was talking about knowledge of one’s own divinity. He’s speaking in parables. YOU DO NOT NEED TO INVOKE THAT WHICH YOU ALREADY POSSESS, THAT’S WHAT BEING A LIVING GOD MEANS.

[quote="Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495"]That's fine if you want to disagree constructively, you should actually add something of substance to your claim.[/quote]

All that would do is cause arguments. I get enough of that on two other forums I moderate. Our experiences differ. What point is there to keep restating our same stances just with different words? You’re not going to change my mind and I’m not going to change yours. All we’ll do is keep saying the same thing over and over. Again, I do enough of that on my two other forums.


don’t be mad this isn’t WF, it’s BALG

[quote="Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495"]This isn't just conjecture. You're claiming this is my opinion. It is not.

It’s my experience.[/quote]

If it’s not an opinion then it must be a fact. And facts are true for everyone, not just yourself or a small group. Unfortunately, my experience differs so it cannot be a fact. In my experience, calling a Voudon spirit under the names of a Norse deity won’t get you anywhere except frustration.

In this argument, I also started out one of my posts by saying “IF YOU UNDERSTAND ANYTHING ABOUT QUANTUM MECHANICS…the names are as necessary as the triangle, because we give it power” so you can clearly see just how I’ve been trolling you this entire time because you never got the point.

[quote="Frater Apotheosis, post:20, topic:2495"]And if it's not yours, good for you, what is yours?[/quote]

That should be obvious. I’ve stated it several times so far…

I’m sorry but this sounds like something out of The Secret or some Tony Robbins “you are your own best friend” speech at the Knowledge Expo. Even Yogis who have dedicated their lives to the spiritual arts can barely do things that would make the vast majority of mankind dub them as gods. Every once and a while you’ll hear stories about this monk being able to levitate or that swami being able to teleport, but those things are hearsay, witnessed by either a small group or people or people who are likely dead now and cannot be independently proven. I’m sorry but the fact is we aren’t the kind of gods you’d like to believe we are. If I shoot you and hit a major artery and you don’t get medical help in time you will die. If I choke you, you will die. If I put you in a car and blow it up, you will die. You cannot move mountains, you cannot fly, you cannot throw fire from your hands. We are human, we have limits. Magic can be used to make life easier but we won’t turn into something out of the latest M Night Shamaylan film.

You asked for my take, and there you have it. I do not wish to argue it as it serves no purpose and takes away from the main point of the thread. As I stated previously, I respect your opinion, and now I kindly ask that you respect mine.

You gotta be kidding me. I tried to end the conversation with a simple sentence saying that my experience differs but I respect your opinion. YOU’RE the one who keeps responding with book length responses attempting to keep the argument going…yet I’m the one trying to argue? #WhereIsTheLogicInThat?

Well, if you understood anything about hermetics, or any ancient disciplines, or you ACTUALLY LISTENED TO THE SECRET ITSELF

THE WOMAN ADMITS SHE PIRATES FROM HERMETIC TEXTS LIKE THE EMERALD TALBLET

SHE ALSO DIVORCED EVERYTHING FROM MAGICK

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU NEED TO MAKE THIS SHIT WORK

THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN DO ANY OF THIS STUFF, IS IF YOU REGULARLY PRACTICE MAGICK AND ARE AWARE OF YOUR OWN DIVINITY,

THAT IS THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN USE THE MATERIAL SHE PRESENTS IN THE WAY SHE PRESENTS IT.

THIS IS SOMETHING YOU TAKE INTO THE RITUAL CIRCLE

  1. DO NOT HAVE DOUBT.

  2. FOCUS ON A POSITIVE OUTCOME

  3. DO NOT ENVISION ANY NEGATIVE OUTCOME

  4. YOU MUST FEEL LIKE YOU HAVE ALREADY ATTAINED THE OUTCOME YOU DID THE RITUAL FOR.
    5.YOU MUST DETACH YOURSELF FROM THE RITUAL UNTIL IT HAPPENS.

  5. YOU CANNOT LUST FOR RESULT

  6. YOU HAVE TO HAVE SUFFICIENT NEED TO DO THE RITUAL

^ THE LAST TWO ARE A PARADOX, BUT THIS IS THE EXACT MINDSET REQUIRED FOR SUCCESS.

if you simply look at those rules, and look at exactly what I say, about just applying this shit in the ritual circle…Where it actually matters…

That’s all this entire message is really about, it doesn’t matter wtf you do, it’s about getting in the right meditative state and doing the ritual with the proper mindset. Otherwise you get an incredibly half assed ritual. Because as Darkest Knight was talking about earlier, you can bind your own power, and you’d be surprised how many people do this
just in the way they frame their rituals.

You are already god,
-Frater Apotheosis

maybe that’s why koetting doesn’t use divine names when he does evocation…maybe the divine names are there just to give you the right state of authority…if you believe that a name or a word has enough power to summon a spirit,then propably the spirit will come…
just a thought…

[quote=“dron, post:24, topic:2495”]maybe that’s why koetting doesn’t use divine names when he does evocation…maybe the divine names are there just to give you the right state of authority…if you believe that a name or a word has enough power to summon a spirit,then propably the spirit will come…
just a thought…[/quote]

That’s exactly why.

He doesn’t need to call on anyone to remind him he’s boss.

He just does the ritual, like a boss and a god, or like a boss god, because he is a divine being aware of his omnipotence already.

You are already god,
-Frater Apotheosis

[quote=“dron, post:24, topic:2495”]maybe that’s why koetting doesn’t use divine names when he does evocation…maybe the divine names are there just to give you the right state of authority…if you believe that a name or a word has enough power to summon a spirit,then propably the spirit will come…
just a thought…[/quote]

The problem here is that you’re assuming. The only way to remove all doubt is to try it and see if results come about. Using no God names is vastly different than using ones that the spirit you’re evoking doesn’t recognize.

You worked with the Lwa, Baphomet ??

Otherwise, don’t understand why this discussion is heating up. Baphomet didn’t get disrespectful in any way and brings some valuable assessment.[/quote]

I’m not sure why it heated up neither. I tried to move along with one simple sentence. Anyway; No sir, but I know enough about the ATRs from my Quimbanda study and practice to know who the spirits owe allegiance to and who they do not. Plus its just common sense, again going back to my store manager example.

[quote=“The Eye”]I’m not discussing what you said (and btw it made me laugh, I mean calling Bossou 3 horns in the name of Odin, lol), but since you mentioned specifically Lwas that made me wonder, hence my question.

Thanks for your answer.[/quote]

Sure thing!

Yes, I agree, and even worse would be using ones that made absolutely no sense to you but you picked them up out of a book (or improvised them on a gamble) so there has to be a gut-level of belief there, and understanding.

That’s my analysis of it all, I don’t take this stuff casually (and I’m sure no-one here does either) and there has to be a reason why different godnames came up as the name of the Most High across different civilisations, they can’t all have been wrong except for one small group, whoever we personally might think had the best ideas.

triple facepalm

You’ve never worked through a textbook on Quantum theory in your life. That much is obvious. So please just take your pseudoscientific drivel and shove it.

WE MADE IT ALL UP, IT GETS ALL OF IT'S POWER FROM US!

quadruple facepalm

Enjoy your world of make-believe, nutbag.

Pazuzu and Shiva have absolutely NOTHING to do with Paimon or any spirit of the Goetia who, I assure you, exist as beings in a hierarchy entirely independent of your own existence.

And placing Paimon as a third name in a triangle shows only a complete ignorance of occult principles.

But keep playing your games of make-believe like 99% of other Western occultists and talking like some self-deluded cultist about his “Godhood” while secretly wondering why your magic is so chaotic, half-arsed, and ineffective, because you’ve unleashed dangerous and parasitic forces in your life that are taking you for a delusional ride.

Now let’s see you apply your literally absurd principles of subjectivity to working with, say, Kalfou. I’ll enjoy scrubbing the bloodstains off the floor.

facepalm

Just another crazy man pretending to be a guru …

Invoking Paimon is invoking a very particular essence and power, and if you don’t understand what that essence is and you don’t have a reason for it to be there and knowledge of how it can perform this function you have assigned it, then I’m afraid you don’t know what the fuck you are doing.

Not to mention that by including Paimon in the triangle (assuming you evoke anything more than a puff of smoke in the first place) without any of the other three kings, you have thrown off the elemental and planetary balance, and there will be consequences for you and for your ritual. These may be desired, but in the general case they are likely not desired as they are not even expected. If you did this with one of Amaymon’s spirits, for instance, you might completely negate the ritual.

Hey Poete, how about less ^
And more
[url=http://becomealivinggod.com/forum/mastering-evocation-omnipotence/the-goetia’s-four-kings-and-the-speed-of-the-magic/]http://becomealivinggod.com/forum/mastering-evocation-omnipotence/the-goetia’s-four-kings-and-the-speed-of-the-magic/[/url]

Or at the very least make your stance known in a way that shows WHY you disagree instead of just name calling and trolling. This could be an exellent opportunity for the community which I’m sure you included in that 99% of Western Occultists remark to learn something.

Have a blessed day
TWF

1 Like

triple facepalm

You’ve never worked through a textbook on Quantum theory in your life. That much is obvious. So please just take your pseudoscientific drivel and shove it.

WE MADE IT ALL UP, IT GETS ALL OF IT'S POWER FROM US!

quadruple facepalm

Enjoy your world of make-believe, nutbag.[/quote]

To be honest, most of my understanding of quantum, was given to me directly in the necro and a good deal of RAW (Robert Anton Wilson), I just was able to pick it up from various authors in my life to confirm things I’ve seen, felt, and understood given to me by those spirits. If you don’t see that, that’s your reality tunnel bro.

Also if you’re still mad about me putting the 3 wrong names there, I’d also like to remind you I said I was trolling on that.

The triangle isn’t necessary to anything at all, that’s shit you make necessary.

My first lesson on evocation was given to me by someone who had done it thousands of times. You think my lessons are abstract, this guy basically referenced every major part of the operation as something he did with will alone, and something he needed no protection from any spirit from. Because apparently spirit is so fucking all powerful, IT CAN DO ANYTHING EXCEPT CROSS YOUR FUCKING CIRCLE. That is a god damn stupidity, these are the things that you often believe craft the universe itself, why wouldn’t they have dominion over it to such a degree to step over your petty bullshit.

It is nothing that makes them even real, except your belief that this is going to work.

There is no objective way to evoke.

But there are also plenty of people like myself, who managed it on the first try with no circle, no athame, no invocation of omnipotence. My first evocation to physical manifestation was purely an accident, and it happened on it’s own, without all that shit, I didn’t even banish my ritual area before hand.

But I had spent 1 hour before the ritual, crying, getting out all my negative emotion. and when I did, I reflected and mediated for another hour on why I needed this ritual to work and how I was ready for anything, because nobody I knew actually practiced this. I really focused on my need to make this work, rather than any negative emotions driving me to the ritual. I opened the sigil, started an incantation, that I did not get half way through before the spirit physically manifested before me, As a face in my incense smoke, then locked eyes with me in a “and what did you want” manner.

Incense, and candles, that was all I had. No robes at all, I was in my clothes. I didn’t even understand whether I was invoking or evoking a spirit, but the nature of the grimore indiciates it’s really both at the same time.

I had no circle, no protection, no invocation (other than apparently the same spirit I called), no godnames, this was my first evocation, locked eyes with an ancient god, yet I am fine.

You know who made that ritual work, the guy running it, just like in your rituals. Don’t be lost to your own power as a magician.

Not only am I fine, but I regard it as one of the most successful types of evocations I’ve ever had. To give you an idea about my understanding of quantum, it was bestowed on me, mainly that night. The closest feeling to what that evocation left me with Because of my request was something very similar to the function of Abraryian from the BOA combined with taking MDMA. I was left with a feeling of pure power, I left feeling like my brain was going to be transformed. I’ve done a lot of neurofeedback, and I was comfortable with my understanding that night, that my brain was basically being rewritten.

For the next 6 months, I saw, felt, and knew everything around me was happening because of quantum physics and consciousness, I could see, feel and understand this happening all around me while most people could not, spirit was forcing this upon me, but I was so on the verge of being able to understand all of this, it guided me through a lot very intensely. I saw quantum physics in the most basic of my math problems, in a way that absolutely shocked and amazed my teachers.

Not only that, but the spirit provided excellent guidance in rigging up my magick to various understanding of typical quantum mechanics with various applied understandings in magick.

I wire all my magick through quantum physics and an understanding of the holographic universe, because I relate this to be closest to my understandings and experiences of the astral world, as well as something that’s mathematically and objectively provable as any mathematical and scientific method of proving the universe can be.

At this point, it’s less about magick, than being an engineer of consciousness

Maybe that sounds like new age drivel to you, but what the hell do you think spirits were going to give me?

I talk about Azazel and quantum all the time and nobody says a god damn thing.

How come so few of you can even relate these things in a fashion like this, after everything E.A. has to teach about the quantum nature of Azazel, there is so much out there already with how E.A. teaches magick that so many of you miss out on.

Maybe I actually do have an understanding of quantum.

Maybe I spend my spare time talking to people who are going to CERN to get their PHD on time travel.

This is what I used to talk to E.A. about when I was a teenager dude. Long before this place existed I have known him and talked to him. We used to have conversations about the holographic universe.

And now I know why he told me he liked having conversations with me, because most people came to him for 2 requests.

They said E.A.

  1. we want you to help us win the lottery.

  2. we want to stop working for the rest of our lives and have everything be provided for us.

  3. Is really possible if you do a number of rituals for it, it will speed it along quite quickly too.

But the problem is, you guys aren’t talking about how the magick works, because you’re still asking spirit how to satisfy your Maslow hierarchy, and picking up magick from that. That’s completely different than going to spirit and saying “give me knowledge of the the architecture of the universe”, “give me knowledge of how to evoke spirits to physical manifestation”, “give me knowledge of magick, and how it works”. I really have spent a good deal of time trying to approach spirits for knowledge, and the answers they give you will hit you in the face harder than a 14 inch steel demon cock.

The question is, are you ready to hear that?

You are already god,
-Frater Apotheosis

[quote=“-TWF-, post:34, topic:2495”]Hey Poete, how about less ^
And more
[url=http://becomealivinggod.com/forum/mastering-evocation-omnipotence/the-goetia’s-four-kings-and-the-speed-of-the-magic/]http://becomealivinggod.com/forum/mastering-evocation-omnipotence/the-goetia’s-four-kings-and-the-speed-of-the-magic/[/url]

Or at the very least make your stance known in a way that shows WHY you disagree instead of just name calling and trolling. This could be an exellent opportunity for the community which I’m sure you included in that 99% of Western Occultists remark to learn something.

Have a blessed day
TWF[/quote]

Damn, I regretfully overlooked this! A bit too late to react to it now. But still, Poete, maybe you should read the rules of this forum.

That new age drivel is one of the few things anyone has said on this forum that makes sense, Poete can facepalm himself some more, he’s totally off and then some.

Please dont fuck with Hindu God Forms

Yes, I did not and this was nearly 3 years ago.